RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neither operator nor handset supports PD?
"Templin (US), Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> Wed, 25 November 2020 17:10 UTC
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From: "Templin (US), Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: tom petch <ietfc@btconnect.com>, David Allan I <david.i.allan@ericsson.com>, Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>, "ipv6@ietf.org" <ipv6@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neither operator nor handset supports PD?
Thread-Topic: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neither operator nor handset supports PD?
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Date: Wed, 25 Nov 2020 17:10:32 +0000
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> -----Original Message----- > From: tom petch [mailto:ietfc@btconnect.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2020 9:03 AM > To: Templin (US), Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>; David Allan I <david.i.allan@ericsson.com>; Alexandre Petrescu > <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>; ipv6@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neither operator nor handset supports PD? > > From: ipv6 <ipv6-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Templin (US), Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> > Sent: 25 November 2020 14:23 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: David Allan I [mailto:david.i.allan@ericsson.com] > > Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2020 2:29 PM > > > FWIW for a 5G UE, the SMF assigns the interface ID used for LLA etc. as part of the PDU session setup. See TS24.501 clause 9.11.4.10. > > Wouldn't it be better if the interface ID contained a useful piece of information such > as a delegated prefix, instead of just a bag of bits? > > <tp> > No! > An identifier should identify, be unique within its namespace, be easy to use in whatever manner it gets used. > > Load it up with 'useful' semantics and it will become defective as some of the semantics change or aren't present in some cases. > > Brian addressed this back in June. Brian also cited this construction format in RFC7421 (cited as [AER-TRANS]). Fred > Tom Petch > > Fred > > > Cheers > > D > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: ipv6 <ipv6-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Templin (US), Fred L > > Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2020 1:52 PM > > To: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>; ipv6@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neither operator nor handset supports PD? > > > > Alex, see below: > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: ipv6 [mailto:ipv6-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Alexandre > > > Petrescu > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2020 1:33 PM > > > To: ipv6@ietf.org > > > Subject: Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neither operator nor handset supports PD? > > > > > > > > > Le 24/11/2020 à 17:44, Templin (US), Fred L a écrit : > > > > Getting what I said earlier onto this thread, I think we should be > > > > discussing the LLA-based PD scheme specified in: > > > > > > > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-templin-6man-lla-type/ > > > > > > > > What is unique and compelling about this scheme is that it brings > > > > down two birds with one stone; in a single RS/RA exchange, the > > > > mobile node receives both 1) an IPv6 PD, and 2) an LLA that is guaranteed to be unique on the link without having to apply DAD. > > > > > > YEs for 1), but for 2) one would also consider the IPv6CP part of ppp > > > and the PDP protocols. These two protocols are also involved in the > > > negotiation of an IID, LLA or even a GUA some times, on that link. > > > > I assume this exchange happens even before the first IPv6 ND message exchange over the link? If so, then if the PDP protocols > > convey an OMNI LLA even before any IPv6 ND message exchange then the "PD" operation will already be complete since the OMNI > > LLA already contains the delegated prefix. Would that be a useful simplification? > > > > Thanks - Fred > > > > > Delegating a prefix is typically associated by an operation of > > > insertion of an entry in a routing table. That entry should have a > > > next hop address. That address could be an LL address or a GUA. > > > These are negotiated by these IPv6CP or PDP protocols. > > > > > > If it is too complicated to make IPv6-PD option to use the addresses > > > created by IPv6CP or by PDP as nexthop, then one could delegate a > > > prefix without pointing to a nexthop, but using that old p2p trick. > > > > > > Also, the suggestion of this draft of using another LL address comes > > > down to associating several LL addresses to an interface; because the > > > LL address made by PDP or IPv6CP is always there. If such a 2nd LL > > > address is associated to an interface, but is not used in the Gateway > > > as a nexthop field, then one wonders why bothering forming it at all. > > > An interface must always have one LL address, and that is given by > > > IPv6CP or PDP, I think. > > > > > > I am not saying it is not a good idea, though. > > > > > > Alex > > > > > > > > > > > The idea for this LLA-based PD scheme is as follows: > > > > > > > > 1) The requesting router creates a temporary LLA using RFC4941(bis) > > > > and sets a prefix length indication inside the LLA itself. The RR > > > > then uses the LLA as the IPv6 source address of an RS message to send to the delegating router. > > > > > > > > 2) When the delegating router receives the RS, it sees that the IPv6 > > > > source is an RFC4941(bis) address with a non-zero prefix length > > > > indication. The DR then coordinates with the DHCPv6 server to request a PD of the length indicated by the RR. > > > > > > > > 3) When the DR receives the PD from the DHCPv6 server, it creates an > > > > OMNI LLA by embedding the delegated prefix in the IID of fe80::/64, e.g., as fe80::2001:db8:1:2. > > > > The DR then sets a prefix length indication in the OMNI LLA, and > > > > sets the LLA as the destination address of an RA message to send back to the RR. > > > > > > > > 4) When the RR receives the RA message, it sees that the destination > > > > is an OMNI LLA with a non-zero prefix length. The RR then uses the > > > > embedded prefix within the OMNI LLA as its delegated prefix, and > > > > regards the Router Lifetime as the time at which the delegated prefix needs to be renewed. > > > > > > > > Questions? > > > > > > > > Fred > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > IETF IPv6 working group mailing list ipv6@ietf.org Administrative > > > > Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6 > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > IETF IPv6 working group mailing list > > > ipv6@ietf.org > > > Administrative Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6 > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > IETF IPv6 working group mailing list > > ipv6@ietf.org > > Administrative Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6 > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > IETF IPv6 working group mailing list > ipv6@ietf.org > Administrative Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6 > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > =
- How do you solve 3GPP issue if neither operator n… Gyan Mishra
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Gyan Mishra
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Alexandre Petrescu
- RE: [EXTERNAL] How do you solve 3GPP issue if nei… Manfredi (US), Albert E
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Erik Kline
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… otroan
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… otroan
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… otroan
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Vasilenko Eduard
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Eric Vyncke (evyncke)
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- p2p interfaces (Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP… Jared Mauch
- Re: p2p interfaces (Re: [v6ops] How do you solve … Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: p2p interfaces (Re: [v6ops] How do you solve … Jared Mauch
- Re: p2p interfaces (Re: [v6ops] How do you solve … otroan
- Re: p2p interfaces (Re: [v6ops] How do you solve … Eric Vyncke (evyncke)
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… otroan
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Alexandre Petrescu
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Vasilenko Eduard
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP … Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Alexandre Petrescu
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… David Allan I
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP … Philip Homburg
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP … Ole Troan
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP … Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… tom petch
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP … Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Michael Richardson
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Mark Smith
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Michael Richardson
- Re: p2p interfaces (Re: [v6ops] How do you solve … Jen Linkova
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP … Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Michael Richardson
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Ole Troan
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Mark Smith
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Michael Richardson
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… otroan
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… otroan
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Alexandre Petrescu
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Michael Richardson
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… otroan
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP … Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… otroan
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP … Philip Homburg
- RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP … Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP … Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Philip Homburg
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Templin (US), Fred L
- RE: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Templin (US), Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] How do you solve 3GPP issue if neithe… Alexandre Petrescu