RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6"

"Templin (US), Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> Tue, 20 October 2020 11:54 UTC

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From: "Templin (US), Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>, "sarikaya@ieee.org" <sarikaya@ieee.org>
CC: 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6"
Thread-Topic: [EXTERNAL] Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6"
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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2020 11:54:28 +0000
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Alex,

> Another device is Gateworks' current modem for Iridium, the "GW16130
> Mini-PCIe Satellite Modem - Datasheet".  It is at 1.6GHz (not 12GHz).
> That mentions 'UART' which again is an 'encoder' to me.  Among the
> features it says 'Supports E-mail messages or HTTP POST'.  That means it
> might support IP.  It also says 'Max Message payload: 340 bytes upload,
> 270 bytes download'.  That means if one wants to put IPv6 minimum MTU
> 1280 bytes then one might need to implement IPv6 Fragmentation extension
> headers.

That is what the OMNI Adaptation Layer (OAL) does (and/or the link could
use link-specific segmentation and reassembly).

Thanks - Fred

> -----Original Message-----
> From: ipv6 [mailto:ipv6-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Alexandre Petrescu
> Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2020 3:58 AM
> To: sarikaya@ieee.org
> Cc: 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6"
> 
> This message was sent from outside of Boeing. Please do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and
> know that the content is safe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Le 19/10/2020 à 21:17, Behcet Sarikaya a écrit :
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 19, 2020 at 11:12 AM Alexandre Petrescu
> > <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com <mailto:alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >     Le 19/10/2020 à 17:58, Behcet Sarikaya a écrit :
> >      >
> >      >
> >      > On Mon, Oct 19, 2020 at 10:20 AM Templin (US), Fred L
> >      > <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
> >     <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>>>
> >      > wrote:
> >      >
> >      > Seems like an “IPv6-over-foo” document might be in order; anyone care
> >      > to____
> >      >
> >      > join me on that?____
> >      >
> >      > __
> >      >
> >      >
> >      > IPv6-over-foo on Starlink section would look like
> >      >
> >      > TBD until more is revealed
> >
> >     One in USA could look at the regulator's public database and find which
> >     frequency channel is allocated for Tesla for Starlink.
> >
> >
> >
> > It is 12GHz
> >
> >      From that, one
> >     could find which encoders are available on that frequency.  From that
> >     one could find which protocols are on it.  It makes for a 'foo' in 'IPv6
> >     over foo'.  The link layer.
> >
> >
> > I don't know how to do these?
> 
> One would ask the ATN email list of IETF, to find which protocol runs on
> Starlink satellite links?  Or maybe which protocol runs on typical cheap
> data on satellite links?  Because there was already a draft posted there
> about links for aeronautics draft-maeurer-raw-ldacs-04
> One would also ask the email list of the DRIP WG of IETF because that
> involves drones around air traffic control, which might depend
> peripherally on satellite data links.
> 
> One would check the user guides of devices implementing data
> communications on satellite links.  It's true that the name of a device
> is somehow difficult to find.
> 
> An old example is Q4000 made by Quake Global.  It is an old device that
> I studied about 10 years ago.  It uses RS-232 over the satellite link.
> That would be the 'encoder'.  That means one could put Serial Line
> Internet Protocol (SLIP) on it.   IPv6 works ok over SLIP, even though
> there is no RFC for it.  One might take advantage of the situation to
> write one.  The user manual of that device is at
> https://fccid.io/PB596XXCS/User-Manual/Datasheet-Q4000-1626630
> 
> Another device is Gateworks' current modem for Iridium, the "GW16130
> Mini-PCIe Satellite Modem - Datasheet".  It is at 1.6GHz (not 12GHz).
> That mentions 'UART' which again is an 'encoder' to me.  Among the
> features it says 'Supports E-mail messages or HTTP POST'.  That means it
> might support IP.  It also says 'Max Message payload: 340 bytes upload,
> 270 bytes download'.  That means if one wants to put IPv6 minimum MTU
> 1280 bytes then one might need to implement IPv6 Fragmentation extension
> headers.
> 
> During these searches I found that maybe SpaceX launched devices for
> Iridium in the past, so it might be that current Starlink are acting a
> little bit like Iridium, or so.
> 
> But it is all speculations.
> 
> Alex
> 
> >
> > Behcet
> >
> >     Alex
> >
> >
> >      >
> >      > Behcet
> >      >
> >      > __
> >      >
> >      > Fred____
> >      >
> >      > __ __
> >      >
> >      > *From:*Behcet Sarikaya [mailto:sarikaya2012@gmail.com
> >     <mailto:sarikaya2012@gmail.com>
> >      > <mailto:sarikaya2012@gmail.com <mailto:sarikaya2012@gmail.com>>]
> >     *Sent:* Monday, October 19, 2020
> >      > 8:14 AM *To:* Michael Richardson <mcr@sandelman.ca
> >     <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca>
> >      > <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca>>>; 6man WG
> >     <ipv6@ietf.org <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org>
> >      > <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org <mailto:ipv6@ietf.org>>> *Cc:* Templin
> >     (US), Fred L
> >      > <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
> >     <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com <mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>>>
> >      > *Subject:* Re: Starlink --- "simpler than IPv6"____
> >      >
> >      > __ __
> >      >
> >      > ____
> >      >
> >      > Thanks Michael, I'd like to know as much as possible how IPv6 works
> >      > in Starlink.____
> >      >
> >      > __ __
> >      >
> >      > Behcet____
> >      >
> >      > __ __
> >      >
> >      > On Fri, Oct 16, 2020 at 3:47 PM Michael Richardson
> >     <mcr@sandelman.ca <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca>
> >      > <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca>>> wrote:____
> >      >
> >      > Anyone read anything more specific about what Starlink is doing that
> >      > is "simpler than IPv6"?
> >      >
> >      > I'd sure like to know that it permits end-terminal to end-terminal
> >      > communicatons without a trip through a data center.
> >      >
> >      > -- ]               Never tell me the odds!                 | ipv6
> >      > mesh networks [ ]   Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works
> >      > |    IoT architect   [ ] mcr@sandelman.ca
> >     <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca> <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca
> >     <mailto:mcr@sandelman.ca>>
> >      > http://www.sandelman.ca/ <http://www.sandelman.ca/>
> >     <http://www.sandelman.ca/ <http://www.sandelman.ca/>>        | ruby on
> >      > rails    [
> >      >
> >      >
> >      > ____
> >      >
> >      >
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