Re: End-to-end (was Re: Non-Last Small IPv6 Fragments)

Fernando Gont <fgont@si6networks.com> Wed, 16 January 2019 16:36 UTC

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Subject: Re: End-to-end (was Re: Non-Last Small IPv6 Fragments)
To: Tom Herbert <tom@herbertland.com>
Cc: Christian Huitema <huitema@huitema.net>, "Bjoern A. Zeeb" <bzeeb-lists@lists.zabbadoz.net>, IPv6 List <ipv6@ietf.org>
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From: Fernando Gont <fgont@si6networks.com>
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Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2019 13:33:36 -0300
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On 16/1/19 12:41, Tom Herbert wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 11:52 PM Fernando Gont <fgont@si6networks.com> wrote:
>>
>> On 15/1/19 19:42, Tom Herbert wrote:
>> [....]
>>> packets. This uses a modifiable HBH options and is completely
>>> idependent of the transport layer.
>>
>> You cannot use HBH in the public Internet. Well, you can... but there
>> high chances your packets will be dropped.
>>
> Fernando,
> 
> By that same thinking we can't use any extension headers at all,

Indeed.



> any
> transport protocol other then TCP (and maybe UDP), ICMP, the TCP
> authentication option, TCP fast open, UDP options, or even IPv6 on the
> Internet. 

I assume that such options focus on specific scenarios (e.g. TCP-AO for
BGP), or they have fall-back options (e.g. traditional open for TCP-FO).
Otherwise they are doomed to fail.



> As for HBH, RFC8200 relaxed the requirement that intermediate nodes
> need to process them. If a node just wants to get to the transport
> layer it can skip over the EH very with a few simple operations. I see
> no excuse for new devices being deployed to systematically drop HBH or
> destination options EHs. If they are  doing that then their
> implementation does not comply with the IPv6 standard and we shouldn't
> have any compunction about publically calling them out on that.

See https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-gont-v6ops-ipv6-ehs-packet-drops

The folks running the networks have work to do. And will certainly not
pay extra money for functionality that somehow is currently not
required. Vendors will not invest extra to sell devices at the same price.

We can call them out. Vendors for selling boxes that perform very badly
for packets that contain EHs, and operators for "looking into packets in
the middle of the network, breaking the sacred e2e principle (or some
interpretation of it)".

Then I guess *we* will be called out to pretend doing engineering, while
doing stuff that doesn't work in practice.

We burying our heads into sand doesn't help the situation, either...

-- 
Fernando Gont
SI6 Networks
e-mail: fgont@si6networks.com
PGP Fingerprint: 6666 31C6 D484 63B2 8FB1 E3C4 AE25 0D55 1D4E 7492