Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions and draft-ietf-bier-ospf-extensions
Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com> Tue, 20 February 2018 18:39 UTC
Return-Path: <akatlas@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: isis-wg@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: isis-wg@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A7E212DA29; Tue, 20 Feb 2018 10:39:28 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.698
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.698 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NDPXi3is_s6U; Tue, 20 Feb 2018 10:39:25 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-oi0-x230.google.com (mail-oi0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4003:c06::230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6D6E912D96A; Tue, 20 Feb 2018 10:39:25 -0800 (PST)
Received: by mail-oi0-x230.google.com with SMTP id l124so10205537oib.0; Tue, 20 Feb 2018 10:39:25 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=n8E1wqYeSKjNJ3tutI9baFbKiRS8oTOL2c8kqZ2ZJ+U=; b=lQket4QI5X15gQijkRs1mBXp3Q/N6yq3TuEEnJetojmVMtghrHMynSe7yMY5WY7mWp d/GxeB5d98OUSnZHZGUQ1wvUdvwMRy1GYYYSxjdYbaP/ghoY+00PHDzpWyk/Q0nK4n5H nJsYorkdr1BnEJ7sCxKqPhOwR/hcGyJt5314mgtzsDreUWYSr2Z4gQHP02qQ2dr5uWJv pEi/aw5/Sfq+ZgkwpNPO+7LVFnkUEcfZvpejST5nVMW11SO5msvEM1La18rar/cVZa1/ WbatI7eiFnWFnGvk/Oz0JuAoBLMReHV/4VKIOc7Q1ffCrviK/rhdUl4RXZsTzm69YYZp /buA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=n8E1wqYeSKjNJ3tutI9baFbKiRS8oTOL2c8kqZ2ZJ+U=; b=eT0gObdoi/3OcAGU2dQwa8Rf1hgzvBRMy2srNYVjAqw9G9hmwPL1tLc3xNFyKs8NY6 2tFr9VY+SAOGYVMIBVL228gcdO9v9xdzWCuWX0JnzgTNXRt4UYTTvdlw33MNte6Qo2DO lnmyDgk/d2lGrT19TMK4DM0AU5U5gvsF/HxIwUxOUatOusP3iWSXio8lXaH+AgO/z2nZ OX5MAn9Bu23yPh054iRBPH95EXTPTjFZ0R4FVg/xeIgCWckGZwHZRfdnA8/9faZQOH0w UkvBCLbWSNFx2HgFU7FtBSsvkmMAY3oCBY2ULBKKrCxyrxWYyChZyMMAOIU6sj//RIxu 3q1Q==
X-Gm-Message-State: APf1xPBFQTazCxHU4aUZHvrkR8M6hzdpHRYW9ouuwH833M9XnnC3/NQN AX9yvg9B5wyTRJcMJHE8qY3MYIckfsZbciFIh78=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AG47ELsIToKaWHJMAeKDU4f6ULe26upEqJaH88xrxVKPK9/tc9Mr8x3mbsR7H3lp2fHZj+li0/1LN2c+AtOhS9AlJuY=
X-Received: by 10.202.94.2 with SMTP id s2mr416463oib.248.1519151964381; Tue, 20 Feb 2018 10:39:24 -0800 (PST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.157.68.57 with HTTP; Tue, 20 Feb 2018 10:39:23 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <9E10FC77-BC21-4E82-883A-420603D5A5B1@cisco.com>
References: <CAG4d1remdUKutEdc2DU6Gaan3z63CAZVo1D-L0GXg_=eHJxffw@mail.gmail.com> <5A8C5A99.8090201@cisco.com> <9E10FC77-BC21-4E82-883A-420603D5A5B1@cisco.com>
From: Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2018 13:39:23 -0500
Message-ID: <CAG4d1rdgeQKkRVTaietcwE+1dALFYwOyVq2XXHWnEwDaZ3gsxA@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" <acee@cisco.com>
Cc: "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" <ppsenak@cisco.com>, BIER WG <bier@ietf.org>, "isis-wg@ietf.org list" <isis-wg@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a113d53843266e60565a92142"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/isis-wg/1kPGzLRijNyjnTAHi8mgGoxbRag>
Subject: Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions and draft-ietf-bier-ospf-extensions
X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group <isis-wg.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/isis-wg>, <mailto:isis-wg-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/isis-wg/>
List-Post: <mailto:isis-wg@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:isis-wg-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg>, <mailto:isis-wg-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2018 18:39:28 -0000
Hi Acee, Thanks for your feedback. I appreciate and agree with the perspective. Regards, Alia On Tue, Feb 20, 2018 at 1:36 PM, Acee Lindem (acee) <acee@cisco.com> wrote: > Hi Alia, > I support Peter's position on the draft. While I believe at 8 bit space is > more than enough to support variations of the BIER algorithm for the > foreseeable future, I think reaching consensus is more critical than the > precise encoding. > > Thanks, > Acee > > On 2/20/18, 12:28 PM, "Isis-wg on behalf of Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" < > isis-wg-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of ppsenak@cisco.com> wrote: > > Hi Alia, > > 1. I see a benefit in having the BIER a way to map to any of the IGP > algorithms. Simply because IGPs already provide paths to all nodes in > the domain and BIER can simply use these paths instead of computing > its own. > > 2. Not sure if people plan to deploy the BIER in a model where it does > its own topology related computations, independent of IGPs. If they do, > I'm not objecting that. > > The encoding of the BAR though must be done in a way that it easily > supports both (1) and (2). > > my 2c, > Peter > > > > On 19/02/18 22:51 , Alia Atlas wrote: > > As the Sponsoring AD for draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-07 and > > draft-ietf-bier-ospf-extensions-12, I have been following the > discussion > > on the mailing list with interest. > > > > I have not seen clear consensus for any change. > > > > Let me be clear on what I see the options are from the discussion. > Then > > I'll elaborate > > a bit on how you can express your perspective most usefully. > > > > 1) Current Status: Bier Algorithm (BAR) field is 8 bits. Currently, > > only value 0 is specified. The drafts do not have an IANA registry - > > with the expectation that one will be created when the first > additional > > use is clear. It is possible that there will be objections from the > > IESG to progressing without an IANA registry. Given the lack of > clarity > > for future use-cases and after discussion, I decided not to force one > > after my AD review - but I will not push back against having a BIER > IANA > > registry if raised by others. > > > > 2) Option B: Add a BAR sub-type of 8 bits. This would modify the > > current TLVs. > > Define an IANA registry for the BAR type. The meaning of the BAR > > sub-type derives > > from the BAR type. We can debate over the registration policy > for > > the BAR type. > > > > 3) Option C: Change the BAR field to be 16 bits and define an IANA > > registry. Part of the range can be FCFS with Expert Review, part > can be > > Specification Required, and part can be IETF Consensus. > > > > 4) Option D: At some point in the future, if there is an actual > > understood and documented need, a BAR sub-type could be added a > > sub-TLV. The length of the BAR sub-type could be determined when the > > sub-TLV is defined. > > > > Given > > > > a) option D exists > > b) there is currently only one defined value for BAR > > c) I do not see strong consensus for change to one particular > other > > option > > > > I see no current reason for a change and I certainly see absolutely > no > > reason for > > a delay in progressing the documents. > > > > I do want to be clear about what the WG wants to do on this issue. > > Therefore, here is > > my following request. > > > > Please send your feedback to the mailing list as follows: > > > > IF you prefer or can accept the current status, please say so. No > more > > justification > > or reasoning is required. I just don't want the bulk of folks who are > > content to be > > overlooked by those suggesting change. > > > > IF you prefer or can accept the current status, but think there > should > > be an IANA registry > > as is usual for managing code-points, please say so. No more > > justification is needed. > > > > IF you prefer Option B, C, and/or D, please say so with your > > explanation. More technical depth than "'we might need it" would be > > helpful; the availability of sub-TLVs already > > provides future proofing. > > > > IF you have a clear technical objection to why the Current Status is > not > > acceptable, > > please express that - with clear details. > > > > IF you feel that additional code-points should be allocated in a BAR > > IANA Registry or > > have thoughts on the appropriate policy, please say so with your > > explanation for what > > those should be. > > > > Unless I see clear and strong consensus for something other than the > > Current Status, > > that will remain. > > > > IF there is clear and strong consensus for Option B, C, or D, or > adding > > an IANA registry with particular values, then it will be possible to > > have a change up through this Weds night - with a 1 week WGLC on that > > particular technical change. > > > > My priority is to have the base BIER specifications published as > > Proposed Standards so that more BIER implementations and deployment > can > > be done. I would like the WG to wrap up the core work (as expressed > in > > the proposed recharter) so that you all can look > > at how to use it. > > > > Given this topic was raised last Weds and given that there are no > > technical objections raised to the documents as are, there isn't much > > time - so please just respond to this email ASAP. My deadline for a > > decision is 6pm EST on Weds. > > > > Regards, > > Alia > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > BIER mailing list > > BIER@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > > > > _______________________________________________ > Isis-wg mailing list > Isis-wg@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg > > >
- [Isis-wg] BAR field length in draft-ietf-bier-isi… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Toerless Eckert
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Dolganow, Andrew (Nokia - SG/Singapore)
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Jeff Tantsura
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Senthil Dhanaraj
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Senthil Dhanaraj
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Dolganow, Andrew (Nokia - SG/Singapore)
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Peter Psenak
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… arkadiy.gulko
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Eric C Rosen
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Peter Psenak
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Xiejingrong
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands (iwijnand)
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands (iwijnand)
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands (iwijnand)
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… IJsbrand Wijnands (iwijnand)
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Alia Atlas
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang
- Re: [Isis-wg] [Bier] BAR field length in draft-ie… Tony Przygienda