Re: [ipwave] VW Golf 8 and WiFi/WLANp/Car2X

Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> Mon, 13 January 2020 16:38 UTC

Return-Path: <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: its@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: its@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC13D1200C3 for <its@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 13 Jan 2020 08:38:17 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.632
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.632 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ak840lWDQErN for <its@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 13 Jan 2020 08:38:14 -0800 (PST)
Received: from sainfoin-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr (sainfoin-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr [132.167.192.228]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C650812085C for <its@ietf.org>; Mon, 13 Jan 2020 08:38:13 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (pisaure.intra.cea.fr [132.166.88.21]) by sainfoin-sys.extra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id 00DGc9dp022117; Mon, 13 Jan 2020 17:38:09 +0100
Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 081132067FE; Mon, 13 Jan 2020 17:38:09 +0100 (CET)
Received: from muguet1-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr (muguet1-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr [132.166.192.12]) by pisaure.intra.cea.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDB7C2067FD; Mon, 13 Jan 2020 17:38:08 +0100 (CET)
Received: from [10.11.240.63] ([10.11.240.63]) by muguet1-sys.intra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id 00DGc7MN012141; Mon, 13 Jan 2020 17:38:08 +0100
From: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
To: "its@ietf.org" <its@ietf.org>
Cc: "Sri Gundavelli (sgundave)" <sgundave@cisco.com>
References: <2613B82E-CE1C-4E1F-9AA5-CA3605097FD1@cisco.com> <2eb82021-504a-243c-fc77-8783c0573789@gmail.com> <D9DC5800.3237E8%sgundave@cisco.com> <981b8bd1-bef1-7d4a-a2b3-f3a7edf2e8a7@gmail.com> <B649ADB9-2A81-416A-A573-9694D81CE8D8@cisco.com> <96a0feab-312d-a8b9-60af-00d105aca3a5@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <171e6328-479a-6018-ee33-49066efb8d43@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2020 17:38:06 +0100
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.3.1
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <96a0feab-312d-a8b9-60af-00d105aca3a5@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Language: fr
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/its/QlzK3IC2tavkw0JmuqC6zDkih68>
Subject: Re: [ipwave] VW Golf 8 and WiFi/WLANp/Car2X
X-BeenThere: its@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IPWAVE - IP Wireless Access in Vehicular Environments WG at IETF <its.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/its>, <mailto:its-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/its/>
List-Post: <mailto:its@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:its-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its>, <mailto:its-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2020 16:38:18 -0000

the first hands-on reviews of the VW 8 are in the printed press: no sign 
of WLANp, nor ITS-G5 or C2C messaging as of yet.  It might be because 
the reviewer is not interested in these aspects (no other mentioning of 
other connectivity features like webradio or wifi on board or remote 
software update) or it might be because these WLANp features are absent 
from actual deployment.

the first VW Golf 8 is announced to be sold in France for mid 2020, with 
prices announced in March.

Le 04/12/2019 à 17:10, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
> I got to learn about VW Golf 8th generation (VW Golf 8, VW 8 for our
> discussion).
> 
> On Oct. 24th they announced it on the web; it says uniquely (strangely)
> 'WLANp' and 'Car2X'.  These seem terms only use by VW, while others say
> 802.11p or Car2Car Consortium or V2X.  The announcement in French text
> says 'WiFi' instead of 802.11p, which is wrong again.
> 
> Some of the features in the announcement text make think there is some
> Bluetooth and NFC in there as well (WeConnect), and also CarPlay,
> AndroidAuto.  I cant figure out whether there is SIM card inside, like
> in Tesla. (be it software or a typical hard sim).
> 
> VW 8 might hit the road in Spring or Summer 2020.
> 
> It is not clear whether the Car2X/WLANp features are series features, or
> extras to be paid for.  Other announcements in America (Caddillac was
> that?) did the same, and the 11p was something additional to be sold for
> a series car.
> 
> Once VW 8 is on the market, there are few places (Grenoble, Paris area,
> Versailles) where I discussed with people and might be interested to
> learn whether that VW 8 understands the RSUs in these areas.
> 
> VW made a similar announcement of a series car 'Arteon' in 2017 and
> later in 2018 that is controlled by infrastructure (respect speed
> limits); that could only be with V2X.  However, it did not materialize
> once the car hit the roads.  Or at least I am not aware of that
> materialization.
> 
> A discussion I had with someone who knows someone explains that a
> competitor of VW (Daimler) is more interested in the cellular aspects
> (e.g. LTE-V2X, even if this term itself is more of a VW term some
> times), and not at all in 802.11p, which is itself not right (the right
> term is 802.11-OCB).
> 
> (a final note about cellular systems with V2X capabilities: the features
> of cellular systems that are specific to cars like direct V2V
> connectivity, or V2V2I, were announced many times in the past for 2.5G,
> 3G and 4G; they were never put to market either).
> 
> Alex
> 
> _______________________________________________
> its mailing list
> its@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its