Re: [ipwave] SATCOM for cars

Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> Tue, 02 June 2020 12:39 UTC

Return-Path: <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: its@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: its@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 867113A07F7 for <its@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 2 Jun 2020 05:39:10 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.669
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.669 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4ICRGE1TTCZ7 for <its@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 2 Jun 2020 05:39:09 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from oxalide-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr (oxalide-smtp-out.extra.cea.fr [132.168.224.13]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DDB523A07F5 for <its@ietf.org>; Tue, 2 Jun 2020 05:39:08 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (pisaure.intra.cea.fr [132.166.88.21]) by oxalide-sys.extra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id 052Cd6JZ014323 for <its@ietf.org>; Tue, 2 Jun 2020 14:39:06 +0200
Received: from pisaure.intra.cea.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id DF18120B74F for <its@ietf.org>; Tue, 2 Jun 2020 14:39:06 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from muguet2-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr (muguet2-smtp-out.intra.cea.fr [132.166.192.13]) by pisaure.intra.cea.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id D550620B6DD for <its@ietf.org>; Tue, 2 Jun 2020 14:39:06 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from [10.11.242.192] ([10.11.242.192]) by muguet2-sys.intra.cea.fr (8.14.7/8.14.7/CEAnet-Internet-out-4.0) with ESMTP id 052Cd47f031371 for <its@ietf.org>; Tue, 2 Jun 2020 14:39:06 +0200
To: its@ietf.org
References: <59a125c29a2b456ab38807625b4c1511@boeing.com>
From: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8a219f59-f483-0e4d-b538-339f01229923@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 2 Jun 2020 14:39:04 +0200
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.8.1
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <59a125c29a2b456ab38807625b4c1511@boeing.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Language: fr
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/its/YqeZGWcxos4BuxilXz22fcPNBXw>
Subject: Re: [ipwave] SATCOM for cars
X-BeenThere: its@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IPWAVE - IP Wireless Access in Vehicular Environments WG at IETF <its.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/its>, <mailto:its-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/its/>
List-Post: <mailto:its@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:its-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its>, <mailto:its-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Jun 2020 12:39:11 -0000


Le 02/06/2020 à 01:27, Templin (US), Fred L a écrit :
> Hi, I got interested in whether cars will in the future include 
> SATCOM access technologies the way airplanes do and came across 
> this:
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oNgGOL6Yto
> 
> The clip is an interview of Elon Musk and asks for his assessment as
>  to whether future Teslas will come equipped with Starlink gear. If 
> you listen to the clip, Elon Musk seems to be saying "not now, but 
> possibly feasible in the future" whereas the narrator seemed to 
> articulate a more negative viewpoint.
> 
> But, thinking about it, a SATCOM service in cars would offer a true 
> multilink capability when coupled with 5G, OCB, etc. And, it would 
> provide service continuity outside of metropolitan areas. Lots of 
> considerations to think about - antenna and base station size, power,
> cost, etc. - but I think would pass the mythbusters plausibility
> test. Will we see cars with SATCOM in the not-too-distant future?

It's a very good question.

I agree a multilink data capability to the automobile is an essential
tool, going beyond the 5G vs G5 (OCB) competitions.

Satellite-like Digital Audio Broadcast is rolling out in high end
automobiles recently, and probably that is just a premise to satellite.

You mention Tesla, but earlier I heard also Toyota also considering
their own mini satellite constellation for their cars.  Some specific
car antennas were mentioned like Kymeta, which are small, without moving
parts.

 From the infrastructure perspective, of course, there is the question of
putting and operating many satellites up there.  But more down to earth
there are questions of equipping tunnels with GPS (and other
satellite-issued) signal relayers, for more coverage.

Satellite to the car might also be an issue of cost.  If Tesla avoids
substituting lidars for radars in the car because of cost, it's natural
to imagine one would avoid putting satellite receivers because of same
reason (not the cost of receiver, but the cost of satellite up there).
One does not want to produce a fully and permanently connected
automobile that is too expensive to buy for the middle class in a new
G-X country (G7, G20, G-whatever).

Finally, but an equally important point: satellite constellations might
make many automobiles happy but might make other people unhappy, like
deep space observers, debris worriers, and more.  All these are very
much inter-related.

Alex

> 
> Fred
> 
> _______________________________________________ its mailing list 
> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>