Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-jsonbis-rfc7159bis-02
Rob Sayre <sayrer@gmail.com> Mon, 01 August 2016 08:04 UTC
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From: Rob Sayre <sayrer@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2016 01:04:54 -0700
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To: Anders Rundgren <anders.rundgren.net@gmail.com>
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Cc: "draft-ietf-jsonbis-rfc7159bis.all@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-jsonbis-rfc7159bis.all@ietf.org>, Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de>, "json@ietf.org" <json@ietf.org>, "Joe Hildebrand (jhildebr)" <jhildebr@cisco.com>, "Matt Miller (mamille2)" <mamille2@cisco.com>, "Martin J. Dürst" <duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp>, "Peter F. Patel-Schneider" <pfpschneider@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-jsonbis-rfc7159bis-02
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The issue doesn't seem to matter. - Rob On Sun, Jul 31, 2016 at 9:58 PM, Anders Rundgren < anders.rundgren.net@gmail.com> wrote: > On 2016-08-01 03:22, Peter F. Patel-Schneider wrote: > >> I don't think that trust enters into the equation here. >> > > The obvious solution is removing the ECMA reference. Not because > "The IETF has a problem with ECMA", but because the idea of having > two organizations being authoritative/normative for a standard is > pointless unless they work together on a single document. > > ECMA should consider referencing the RFC instead of duplicating it. > > Anders > > > >> A standards document, be it from IETF, or from some other organization, >> should >> be complete before being considered for final review. This is not the >> case >> for draft-ietf-jsonbis-rfc7159bis-02 because one of its normative >> references >> is not available for review in the form that it needs to be to support >> draft-ietf-jsonbis-rfc7159bis-02. Trust in ECMA or WG chairs or ADs is no >> substitute for having an actual document to review. >> >> If there is trust involved it would be trusting that ECMA doesn't turn >> around >> and remove the reciprocal language in a future revision of ECMA-404. >> >> peter >> >> >> On 07/30/2016 03:13 AM, Martin J. Dürst wrote: >> >>> I think this is an issue of trust, from both sides. For those not in a >>> mood to >>> trust ECMA, I suggest they trust our WG chairs and ADs. >>> >>> (If everything goes really wrong, we can always issue a revision with the >>> reference to the ECMA side removed.) >>> >>> Regards, Martin. >>> >>> On 2016/07/29 01:13, Julian Reschke wrote: >>> >>>> On 2016-07-28 18:05, Joe Hildebrand (jhildebr) wrote: >>>> >>>>> I agree that the document should not be published as an RFC until we >>>>> have the equivalent last-call doc from ECMA, and we do a coordinated >>>>> publish of the two documents. But having our side ready to go, >>>>> including finishing AUTH48, will allow us to not be the bottleneck in >>>>> that process. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Not sure. "approved" means "approved". I believe we need a mechanism >>>> that makes sure that the update of 404 not only happens, but that it >>>> also contains the change we expect. >>>> >>>> I believe we have adequate protections in place with Alexey not >>>>> pushing the button until the right time, and making sure that the RFC >>>>> Production Center is aware of the dependency to what amounts to a >>>>> downref. >>>>> >>>>> Would it help if we replaced the ECMA-404 reference with a a ref to >>>>> ECMA-404bis (with details left out)? That would make it *very* clear >>>>> to the RPC what we intend, and would trigger processes they have in >>>>> place to ensure the reference is resolved before publishing. >>>>> >>>> >>>> I think that helps, but it's not sufficient. >>>> >>>> Best regards, Julian >>>> >>>> PS: ...and we need a minor revision anyway; see prior feedback. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> json mailing list >>>> json@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/json >>>> . >>>> >>>> >> _______________________________________________ >> json mailing list >> json@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/json >> >> > _______________________________________________ > json mailing list > json@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/json >
- [Json] Early AD review of draft-ietf-jsonbis-rfc7… Alexey Melnikov
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Rob Sayre
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Anders Rundgren
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Peter F. Patel-Schneider
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Alexey Melnikov
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Tim Bray
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Stefan Hagen
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Mark Nottingham
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Peter F. Patel-Schneider
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Peter F. Patel-Schneider
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Julian Reschke
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Joe Hildebrand (jhildebr)
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Peter F. Patel-Schneider
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Matt Miller (mamille2)
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Anders Rundgren
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Julian Reschke
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Alexey Melnikov
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Anders Rundgren
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Julian Reschke
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Peter F. Patel-Schneider
- [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-json… Matt Miller (mamille2)
- Re: [Json] Early AD review of draft-ietf-jsonbis-… Barry Leiba
- Re: [Json] Working Group Last Call of draft-ietf-… Julian Reschke
- Re: [Json] Early AD review of draft-ietf-jsonbis-… Tim Bray
- Re: [Json] Early AD review of draft-ietf-jsonbis-… Manger, James