IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [Json] -0.0

John Cowan <cowan@mercury.ccil.org> Mon, 30 September 2013 00:28 UTC

Return-Path: <cowan@ccil.org>
X-Original-To: json@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: json@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B29F121F9D94 for <json@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 29 Sep 2013 17:28:47 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -3.3
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.299, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xqiPl0sJyC1p for <json@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 29 Sep 2013 17:28:42 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from earth.ccil.org (earth.ccil.org [192.190.237.11]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4816A21F9D92 for <json@ietf.org>; Sun, 29 Sep 2013 17:28:35 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from cowan by earth.ccil.org with local (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from <cowan@ccil.org>) id 1VQRLj-0006Ht-Rl; Sun, 29 Sep 2013 20:28:31 -0400
Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2013 20:28:31 -0400
From: John Cowan <cowan@mercury.ccil.org>
To: Tim Bray <tbray@textuality.com>
Message-ID: <20130930002831.GJ27126@mercury.ccil.org>
References: <CAHBU6iu=LbwcZgEPzKgurR7s+jCUeVMEagq1knzOBWUky9SLoA@mail.gmail.com> <52454988.5030706@it.aoyama.ac.jp> <20130927214137.GC24460@mercury.ccil.org> <BF7E36B9C495A6468E8EC573603ED9411EF1E1E5@xmb-aln-x11.cisco.com> <CAChr6SxfAv+yjEzsn2R=S79MviRN+bYak=8Nnnkw9hfs3p1zxw@mail.gmail.com> <CAChr6SxYSzXGf5hrVNvmdmpHU2R+cKSH+37NhTc--6iDpfXG3g@mail.gmail.com> <9D959999-63A2-46EF-8C14-C48F586D9DA4@tzi.org> <CAChr6Sz4Hg--YrWnxXOxJJmbx=AmjDoEZXxs7HeTV58w5VSRDg@mail.gmail.com> <25C6CA6F-76F0-42DE-8845-850B8B69F1A6@tzi.org> <CAHBU6is6w6WpsYOeOP=yMREAhz90+J4OPC6uVB+nXca2aJMmpg@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <CAHBU6is6w6WpsYOeOP=yMREAhz90+J4OPC6uVB+nXca2aJMmpg@mail.gmail.com>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2009-06-14)
Sender: John Cowan <cowan@ccil.org>
Cc: Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>, R S <sayrer@gmail.com>, JSON WG <json@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Json] -0.0
X-BeenThere: json@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: "JavaScript Object Notation \(JSON\) WG mailing list" <json.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/json>, <mailto:json-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/json>
List-Post: <mailto:json@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:json-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/json>, <mailto:json-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 00:28:47 -0000

Tim Bray scripsit:

> Yeah, but my opinion is shifting here... it's starting to feel to me
> like there's nothing remotely JSON-specific about the problems around
> -0.

There isn't, but JSON is what we are working on today.  "It is not
incumbent upon you to complete the work, but neither are you at liberty
to desist from it." (R. Tarfon, _Pirke Avot_ 2:21, ca. 100 C.E.)

> - Remove "are represented without "frac" or "exp" parts (for example
> as 3 not 3.0)"

+1

> - Lose the whole paragraph beginning "Numbers which represent zero
> without a sign...

-1

> Less is more. Is anyone passionate about keeping either?

I do feel that we should warn about negative zero.  Unlike XML, JSON
claims to transmit numbers, and we should warn about the limits of that
capability.

-- 
Let's face it: software is crap. Feature-laden and bloated, written under
tremendous time-pressure, often by incapable coders, using dangerous
languages and inadequate tools, trying to connect to heaps of broken or
obsolete protocols, implemented equally insufficiently, running on
unpredictable hardware -- we are all more than used to brokenness.
                   --Felix Winkelmann

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email