Re: Advancing the Protocol and Morin Drafts

Yakov Rekhter <yakov@juniper.net> Fri, 10 October 2008 16:09 UTC

Return-Path: <l3vpn-bounces@ietf.org>
X-Original-To: l3vpn-archive@megatron.ietf.org
Delivered-To: ietfarch-l3vpn-archive@core3.amsl.com
Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C89063A698B; Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:09:07 -0700 (PDT)
X-Original-To: l3vpn@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: l3vpn@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4AAE3A67B0 for <l3vpn@core3.amsl.com>; Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:09:06 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -6.599
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7KNaQ8REN3ep for <l3vpn@core3.amsl.com>; Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:09:06 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from exprod7og110.obsmtp.com (exprod7og110.obsmtp.com [64.18.2.173]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D5B23A68AA for <l3vpn@ietf.org>; Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:08:58 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from source ([66.129.228.6]) by exprod7ob110.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP; Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:09:06 PDT
Received: from p-emlb02-sac.jnpr.net ([66.129.254.47]) by p-emsmtp01.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:08:06 -0700
Received: from emailsmtp55.jnpr.net ([172.24.18.132]) by p-emlb02-sac.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:08:06 -0700
Received: from magenta.juniper.net ([172.17.27.123]) by emailsmtp55.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:08:06 -0700
Received: from juniper.net (sapphire.juniper.net [172.17.28.108]) by magenta.juniper.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id m9AG86M66693; Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:08:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from yakov@juniper.net)
Message-Id: <200810101608.m9AG86M66693@magenta.juniper.net>
To: "RAMACHANDRAN, PRASANNA, ATTOPS" <prasanna@att.com>
Subject: Re: Advancing the Protocol and Morin Drafts
In-reply-to: <2F1DE4DFCFF32144B771BD2C246E6A20E721CD@misout7msgusr7e.ugd.att.com>
References: <A834346E-E29F-4CD5-94AF-D6B99D1E2D42@multicasttech.com> <2F1DE4DFCFF32144B771BD2C246E6A20E721CD@misout7msgusr7e.ugd.att.com>
X-MH-In-Reply-To: "RAMACHANDRAN, PRASANNA, ATTOPS" <prasanna@att.com> message dated "Wed, 08 Oct 2008 19:19:08 -0400."
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-ID: <86485.1223654885.1@juniper.net>
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 09:08:05 -0700
From: Yakov Rekhter <yakov@juniper.net>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Oct 2008 16:08:06.0105 (UTC) FILETIME=[61623C90:01C92AF2]
Cc: Ross Callon <rcallon@juniper.net>, l3vpn@ietf.org
X-BeenThere: l3vpn@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: <l3vpn.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/l3vpn>, <mailto:l3vpn-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/private/l3vpn>
List-Post: <mailto:l3vpn@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:l3vpn-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/l3vpn>, <mailto:l3vpn-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
Sender: l3vpn-bounces@ietf.org
Errors-To: l3vpn-bounces@ietf.org

Prasanna,

> I vote NO.
> 
> Being in AT&T Advanced Tier support group and having supported the MVPN
> core for the last 2 years, I can clearly say that we need a solution
> such as PIM-BiDir that can reduce the number of multicast states in the
> PEs to be able to scale the Groups X Sources x OILs explosion for our
> very large Enterprise customers.   We definitely do not want to tweak a
> crucial protocol like BGP of which our scale is 2 Million VPNV4 routes
> in the US alone.

On the subject of "we definitely do not want to tweak", I'd like
to remind you that during the early days of 2547 VPNs some of its
opponents were saying that they are against 2547 VPNs because they
do not want to "tweak" such a crucial protocol as BGP to carry VPNv4
routes.

Today AT&T has "2 million VPNv4 routes in the US alone" all carried
in BGP, and a successful 2547 VPN service. None of this would be
possible if we would not tweak BGP.

Yakov.