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    <p>Hi Paul,<br>
    </p>
    On 04.03.26 15:11, Paul Wouters wrote:<br>
    <blockquote type=3D"cite"
cite=3D"mid:CAGL5yWa6v7awcJv7GAoJ96jgAM7Vy4T4j9nSkiLReUs7zm91Rg@mail.gmai=
l.com">
      <meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3DU=
TF-8">
      <div dir=3D"ltr">
        <div dir=3D"ltr"><br>
        </div>
        <div class=3D"gmail_quote gmail_quote_container">
          <div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 3, 2026 at
            1:02=E2=80=AFPM Muhammad Usama Sardar &lt;<a
              href=3D"mailto:muhammad_usama.sardar@tu-dresden.de"
              moz-do-not-send=3D"true" class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext">mu=
hammad_usama.sardar@tu-dresden.de</a>&gt;
            wrote:<br>
          </div>
          <blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote"
style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);=
padding-left:1ex">
            <div>
              <p>Hi lakers,<br>
              </p>
              <p>Following up with supporting public evidence: <b>Cocos
                  AI has publicly acknowledged [9]</b> the relay attacks
                last Friday.=C2=A0</p>
              <p># <b>Context</b><br>
              </p>
              <p>As helpful context, Cocos AI [4] claimed their attested
                TLS to be the "best in the world" in the Confidential
                Computing Consortium and despite we having informed them
                repeatedly about the attacks after our formal analysis,
                they were continuing to misguide the community on social
                media. Anyway, we now respect their honesty and
                transparency, and we remain fully committed to helping
                them towards secure solutions.</p>
            </div>
          </blockquote>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>The "we" in the context appears to refer to IETF until
            you get to the end and see two people signing of on this
            posting. I would be good to make this more clear and avoid
            talking about "we" on mailing lists.</div>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <p>Please try to understand that I am a researcher and "we" is very
      common use for me, even when writing a single-authored paper. In
      my understanding, consensus of the IETF is represented in RFCs and
      not emails. The emails should at best be interpreted as the list
      of authors mentioned in the email. If I sometimes forget defining
      we, please interpret it in that context.</p>
    <p>BTW there were only two paragraphs until the reader reaches the
      end of the email.<br>
    </p>
    <blockquote type=3D"cite"
cite=3D"mid:CAGL5yWa6v7awcJv7GAoJ96jgAM7Vy4T4j9nSkiLReUs7zm91Rg@mail.gmai=
l.com">
      <div dir=3D"ltr">
        <div class=3D"gmail_quote gmail_quote_container">
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>Furthermore, the tone of this posting is not conducive to
            future collaboration with Cocos AI.=C2=A0The claim of them
            "misguiding" isn't really softened by the statement of "we
            respect them again now".</div>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    The collaboration exists already!<br>
    <blockquote type=3D"cite"
cite=3D"mid:CAGL5yWa6v7awcJv7GAoJ96jgAM7Vy4T4j9nSkiLReUs7zm91Rg@mail.gmai=
l.com">
      <div dir=3D"ltr">
        <div class=3D"gmail_quote gmail_quote_container">
          <div>=C2=A0</div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote"
style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);=
padding-left:1ex">
            <div>
              <p># <b>Cocos AI acknowledgment of attacks</b><br>
              </p>
              <p> Cocos AI (one of the implementers of the protocol) has
                publicly acknowledged [9] our email and the relay
                attacks we highlighted on their design and
                implementation in our email. Particularly, see the
                sections "Limitations and the Relay Attack" and "The
                Relay Attack Scenario" in [9]. Note that their
                description is almost a paraphrase of our email. There
                are some nits that we disagree with them but that
                doesn't matter much. They have essentially acknowledged
                the attacks and shared a short-term, medium-term and
                long-term roadmap for mitigations of the attacks. We
                believe this alone is sufficient supporting evidence.</p>=

            </div>
          </blockquote>
          <div>Similarly, the "has publicly acknowledged" is far from
            friendly, and unhelpful for future cooperation.</div>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    The cooperation exists already! I don't see anything unfriendly and
    unhelpful in the phrase "has publicly acknowledged".<br>
    <blockquote type=3D"cite"
cite=3D"mid:CAGL5yWa6v7awcJv7GAoJ96jgAM7Vy4T4j9nSkiLReUs7zm91Rg@mail.gmai=
l.com">
      <div dir=3D"ltr">
        <div class=3D"gmail_quote gmail_quote_container">
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote"
style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);=
padding-left:1ex">
            <div>
              <p>Chairs, if there is some time available and you feel it
                relevant, we would like to request 5 minutes to present
                our formal analysis for lake-ra draft.<br>
              </p>
            </div>
          </blockquote>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>How does this relate to lake? From what I can tell, Cocos
            AI used regular TLS over TCP?</div>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <p>You have already asked this before and I have already answered it
      at [0]. The chairs and authors know the connection and the best I
      can do is a relay attack to relay this question over to them :)
      Hopefully, they can explain in some other words that may resonate
      better with you.<br>
    </p>
    <p>Again, if you and LAKE members want that I don't share any
      results, please let me know and I will then surely not share. If
      you and LAKE members don't want me to present, I'll cancel the
      slot as well. I can raise my concerns at IETF Last Call anyway.<br>=

    </p>
    <p>Best regards,</p>
    <p>-Usama<br>
    </p>
    <p>[0]
      <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"https://mailarchive.ietf=
=2Eorg/arch/msg/lake/VuWYJKpdpJsDqI_rtvgPqMf4y6o/">https://mailarchive.ie=
tf.org/arch/msg/lake/VuWYJKpdpJsDqI_rtvgPqMf4y6o/</a></p>
  </body>
</html>

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