Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang
tom petch <ietfc@btconnect.com> Tue, 11 December 2018 12:25 UTC
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From: tom petch <ietfc@btconnect.com>
To: Xufeng Liu <xufeng.liu.ietf@gmail.com>
CC: "Acee Lindem (acee)" <acee@cisco.com>, Stephane Litkowski <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "lsr@ietf.org" <lsr@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-ospf-yang@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-ospf-yang@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-teas-yang-te-types@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-teas-yang-te-types@ietf.org>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/lsr/tsYY3jy6ITx_IqVjQPE_UigNvXE>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang
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----- Original Message ----- From: "Xufeng Liu" <xufeng.liu.ietf@gmail.com> Sent: Monday, December 10, 2018 2:47 PM Hi Tom, Thanks for checking on this. Agree that we need to fix the description text. What about the following? te-node-id: A type representing the identifier for a node in a TE topology. The identifier is represented as 32-bit unsigned integer in the dotted-quad notation. This attribute MAY be mapped to the Router Address described in Section 2.4.1 of [RFC3630], the TE Router ID described in Section 3 of [RFC6827], the Traffic Engineering Router ID described in Section 4.3 of [RFC5305], or the TE Router ID described in Section 3.2.1 of [RFC6119]. The reachability of such a TE node MAY be achieved by a mechanism such as Section 6.2 of [RFC6827]. Or, would you give a suggestion? <tp> Looks good. One query I cannot answer; should RFC5786 Advertising a Router's Local Addresses in OSPF TE Extensions. R. Aggarwal, K. Kompella. March 2010 be there as well? On the face of it, it looks relevant and would appear to meet a need but I note its absence from ospf-yang; I do not know how widely it is implemented or used. This RFC is updated by RFC6827. Tom Petch Thanks, - Xufeng On Fri, Dec 7, 2018 at 12:14 PM tom petch <ietfc@btconnect.com> wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Xufeng Liu" <xufeng.liu.ietf@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ospf-yang > > > Hi Acee, Tom, and All, > > Several authors of draft-ietf-teas-yang-te-types had a brief discussion > on > this topic. Our take on the te-node-id and te-router-id is: > > - In TEAS, the te-node-id specified in draft-ietf-teas-yang-te-types has > a > wider use scope than IP MPLS TE. The system may or may not run OSPF TE, > and > may not use IPv4. The 32-bit ID number is used only for uniquely > identifying the TE node, and it may or may not be a routable address. > - When RFC3630 is implemented, it is ok to map a routable IPv4 address > (such as the address of loopbak0) to the te-node-id, but it is not > required. > - We intentionally use the term "te-node-id" instead of "te-router-id" > to > convey the concept that this ID is on a TE node, which may or may or be > a > router. > - We will clarify the description to say that "This attribute is MAY be > mapped to TE Router ID in [RFC3630], [RFC5329], [RFC5305], and > [RFC6119]." > > <tp> > > Xufeng > > Thanks for the clarification - I understand better now. > > However, I think that your proposed text is not quite right. RFC5329 > does not defined a TE Router ID - in fact, I think that that concept is > alien to OSPF. OSPF has a 32 bit number that is the Router ID with no > requirement for that to be a routable address; which is why (IMHO) > RFC5329 defines a > Router IPv6 Address TLV > which carries a routable address (which can meet the needs of TE). > > Likewise, RFC3630, for OSPFv2, does not have the concept of a TE Router > ID; rather, it has a > Router Address TLV > which specifies a stable IP address (which can meet the needs of TE). > > And then there is RFC5786 which defines, for OSPF, the > Node Attribute TLV > with sub-TLV for > Node IPv4 Local Address > Node IPv6 Local Address > allowing for multiple TE addresses for different traffic types. > > I grant you that RFC6119 defines a > TE Router ID > but the concept is alien to OSPF (IMHO). > > So, if you want to use the term > TE Router ID > then I think that you will need to explain how that maps onto the > terminology of the existing OSPF RFC. > > Tom Petch > > Thanks, > - Xufeng > > On Thu, Dec 6, 2018 at 12:38 PM Acee Lindem (acee) <acee@cisco.com> > wrote: > > > Hi Tom, > > I think the only action here is for the authors of > > draft-ietf-teas-yang-te-types to fix their te-node-id definition. As > for > > the OSPF Router ID and OSPF/ISIS TE Router IDs we can't change the > decades > > old definitions to achieve uniformity. > > Thanks, > > Acee > > > > On 12/5/18, 11:12 AM, "tom petch" <ietfc@btconnect.com> wrote: > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: <stephane.litkowski@orange.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2018 12:57 PM > > > > > Hi Tom, > > > > > > I think that having a different router-id configured per > protocol is > > a > > matter of deployment. I don't think that we can impose anything in > this > > area. There are use cases where it is good to have separate > router-ids > > per protocol or instances of a protocol. For instance, when a > router is > > part of multiple "administrative domains", it is worth having > separate > > router-ids per admin domain. > > > > > > However I have a concern about the router-id or te-node-id > bound to > > a > > 32 bits number only. How do we do in a pure IPv6 network ? > > > > Stephane > > > > I am used to configuring a router-id as a 32-bit number with no > > requirement for that to be an address that can be accessed over > the > > internet (so I have always found the idea of 'loopback0' > unfortunate). > > Yes, the router needs to be addressable, but merging that concept > with > > a > > router id has always seemed to me unfortunate because they are two > > separate concepts. (In fact, I would regard good practice as > giving a > > router multiple addresses for different functions, so that e.g. > syslog > > can be separated from SNMP or FTP). > > > > Thus I have no problem with a 32-bit router-id in an IPv6 network. > > Indeed, RFC5329 defines a 32-bit router-id in an OSPFv3 > > Intra-Area-TE-LSA. It is the Router IPv6 Address TLV that carries > the > > 128-bit address. > > > > When ospf-yang says > > container te-rid { > > if-feature te-rid; > > description "Stable OSPF Router IP Address used for > Traffic > > Engineering (TE)"; > > leaf ipv4-router-id { type inet:ipv4-address; > description > > "Explicitly configure the TE IPv4 Router ID."; > > } > > leaf ipv6-router-id { > > type inet:ipv6-address; > > description "Explicitly configure the TE IPv6 Router > ID."; > > > > then that is when I wonder what is going on. That looks to me > like > > configuring > > Router IPv6 Address TLV > > not the router id. > > > > Meanwhile, te-yang-te-types has > > > > te-node-id: > > A type representing the identifier for a node in a topology. > The > > identifier is represented as 32-bit unsigned integer in the > > dotted-quad notation. This attribute is mapped to Router ID > in > > [RFC3630], [RFC5329], [RFC5305], and [RFC6119]. > > > > Well, I disagree with their choice of YANG type but agree that it > is > > 32-bit and not 128. > > > > Tom Petch. > > > > > Brgds, > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: tom petch [mailto:ietfc@btconnect.com] > > > Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2018 12:14 > > > To: Acee Lindem (acee); LITKOWSKI Stephane OBS/OINIS; > lsr@ietf.org; > > draft-ietf-ospf-yang@ietf.org; > draft-ietf-teas-yang-te-types@ietf.org > > > Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ospf-yang > > > > > > Acee > > > > > > (Top-posting because the indentation usually fails) > > > > > > On the TEAS te-types, I had a quick look at where > > > typedef te-node-id > > > is used and the answer is lots of places, because it is part of > > > grouping explicit-route-hop { > > > description "The explicit route subobject grouping"; > > > choice type { > > > description "The explicit route subobject type"; > > > case num-unnum-hop { > > > container num-unnum-hop { > > > leaf node-id { > > > type te-types:te-node-id; > > > description "The identifier of a node in the TE > > > topology."; > > > and YANG uses of that grouping are many, in several WGs; > however, > > > because it is a grouping, then the impact of changing the type > should > > be > > > minimal at least in terms of the I-Ds. > > > > > > On the multiple router definitions, my research of the IETF memo > only > > > came up with the two cited RFC which, to me, say that you should > use > > an > > > existing router-id if there is one. > > > > > > I did look at the documentation of A Major Router Manufacturer > and > > while > > > they did not give any advice, the default for a te router-id was > > > loopback0 > > > while the default for a more general router-id, one without te, > was > > > loopback0 > > > which gives me the message, you can make them different but > SHOULD > > NOT > > > (in IETF terminology). > > > > > > So while I agree that the two lsr modules should allow > per-protocol > > > configuration, I think that it should carry a health warning in > the > > body > > > of the I-D that this is not a good idea (I struggle to think of > when > > it > > > would be a good idea, to use three separate identifiers for, > say, BGP > > > and the two lsr protocols). > > > > > > Tom Petch > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" <acee@cisco.com> > > > To: "tom petch" <ietfc@btconnect.com>; > > <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>; > > > <lsr@ietf.org>; <draft-ietf-ospf-yang@ietf.org>; > > > <draft-ietf-teas-yang-te-types@ietf.org> > > > Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2018 7:46 PM > > > > > > > Hi Tom, > > > > > > > > Let me try to explain. > > > > > > > > On 12/4/18, 12:44 PM, "tom petch" <ietfc@btconnect.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > The router id in this I-D confuse me. > > > > > > > > RFC8294 defines > > > > typedef router-id { type yang:dotted-quad; > > > > > > > > Some implementations configure a global router-id while others > only > > > allow it at the control-plane-protocol level. This is why we > have it > > in > > > both places. > > > > > > > > ospf-yang defines > > > > leaf ipv4-router-id { type inet:ipv4-address; > > > > > > > > For better or worse, OSPF has a separate TE address that is > > routable > > > and referred to as the TE router-id. You'll note that this is > part of > > > the te-rid container in both the OSPF and IS-IS YANG models. We > could > > > add "-te-" to the leaves to avoid confusion. > > > > > > > > draft-ietf-teas-yang-te-types defines > > > > typedef te-node-id { type yang:dotted-quad; > > > > ... This attribute is mapped to Router ID .... > > > > > > > > This is just wrong. It is a routable address in the IGP TE > > extensions. > > > I've copied the draft authors. > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Acee Lindem > > > > > > > > > > > > Three different YANG types for a router id. > > > > > > > > Why? > > > > > > > > Behind this, ospf-yang gives as references for a router te > id > > > > RFC3630(V2) and RFC5329(V3). Reading these, my take is > that a > > > router id > > > > is needed for te but that the existing id should be used > where > > > possible > > > > i.e. creating an additional identifier for the same > instance of > > > the same > > > > entity is A Bad Thing (which sounds like a good general > > > principle). > > > > With two objects in the lsr protocols, that would appear > to > > make > > > at > > > > least three identifiers for the same instance of the same > > entity. > > > > > > > > Why? > > > > > > > > I copy Stephane on this since the same issues apply to the > > other > > > lsr > > > > protocol, mutatis mutandi. > > > > > > > > Tom Petch > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > _________________________________________________ > > > > > > Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des > informations > > confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc > > > pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. 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- [Lsr] Shepherd's review of ietf-ospf.yang and dra… stephane.litkowski
- Re: [Lsr] Shepherd's review of ietf-ospf.yang and… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Lsr] Shepherd's review of ietf-ospf.yang and… stephane.litkowski
- Re: [Lsr] Shepherd's review of ietf-ospf.yang and… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Lsr] Shepherd's review of ietf-ospf.yang and… stephane.litkowski
- [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang tom petch
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang tom petch
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang stephane.litkowski
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang tom petch
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang Xufeng Liu
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Lsr] Shepherd's review of ietf-ospf.yang and… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang tom petch
- Re: [Lsr] Shepherd's review of ietf-ospf.yang and… stephane.litkowski
- Re: [Lsr] Shepherd's review of ietf-ospf.yang and… stephane.litkowski
- Re: [Lsr] Shepherd's review of ietf-ospf.yang and… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang Xufeng Liu
- Re: [Lsr] Shepherd's review of ietf-ospf.yang and… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang tom petch
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang Xufeng Liu
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang tom petch
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang Xufeng Liu
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang tom petch
- Re: [Lsr] draft-ietf-ospf-yang Acee Lindem (acee)