Re: [ltans] WG Action: Conclusion of Long-Term Archive and Notary Services (ltans)

Phillip Hallam-Baker <hallam@gmail.com> Wed, 20 July 2011 16:48 UTC

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In-Reply-To: <CA4C777C.73BA%carl@redhoundsoftware.com>
References: <4E26FDEA.1050706@earthlink.net> <CA4C777C.73BA%carl@redhoundsoftware.com>
Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2011 12:48:09 -0400
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From: Phillip Hallam-Baker <hallam@gmail.com>
To: Carl Wallace <carl@redhoundsoftware.com>
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Subject: Re: [ltans] WG Action: Conclusion of Long-Term Archive and Notary Services (ltans)
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Exactly, a WG should do something right or not at all. In this case they
choose not at all. That is fine with me.

Todd seems to be giving some pretty good reasons to not do notary.


What I am interested in is probably a little speculative. I would like to
have a form of data repository that we could establish some pretty good
expectations of it surviving for a very long time and for the integrity of
the data within it to be witnessed by a sufficiently large set of witnesses
that forgery is implausible.



On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 12:32 PM, Carl Wallace <carl@redhoundsoftware.com>wrote:

> The good news is that none of the 5 completed specs address notary-related
> concepts.  Each spec addresses fairly narrow concepts consistent with the
> backgrounds of the volunteers contributing the work.  While it may be
> unfortunate that the term notary appears in the working group name, the
> notary concept was from the inception of the working group considered to
> be a topic area that would not necessarily result in new standards.
>
> On 7/20/11 12:10 PM, "todd glassey" <tglassey@earthlink.net>; wrote:
>
> >On 7/20/2011 8:12 AM, Carl Wallace wrote:
> >> On 7/20/11 10:49 AM, "todd glassey"<tglassey@earthlink.net>;  wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 7/19/2011 6:28 PM, IESG Secretary wrote:
> >>>> The Long-Term Archive and Notary Services (ltans) working group in the
> >>>> Security Area has concluded. The IESG contact persons are Sean Turner
> >>>> and Stephen Farrell.
> >>> So there is actually no Notary's process in any of this code.
> >> Correct.  In accord with the charter, a requirements gathering effort
> >>for
> >> potential notary-related work was conducted.
> > From who - the engineers working on the protocol??? - do any of them
> >have legal backgrounds which would be competent to advise here? Will any
> >of their sponsors take legal culpability for those parties actions?  You
> >see my point?
> >
> >Its time for accountability here in the IETF to be real.
> >> The results were reviewed by
> >> the working group and work on notary-related standards was suspended at
> >> IETF 65 due to lack of interest in pursuing the topic.
> >
> >Which means that the terms and any reference to the concept of "Legal
> >Document Control" per the apostles practices have to be cleansed from
> >these works.  i.e. someone with a redline needs to cut out all
> >references to Notary anything. That said, it means simply that this WG
> >isnt done and that until those issues are completed, that NONE of the
> >works can be finalized... or that they can and must all be pulled -
> >since the IETF itself becomes a party to the fraud of misrepresenting
> >its IP's as 'replacing legal roles' in the Human population.
> >
> >The IETF has never made a legal statement about any of its protocols
> >before LTANS, but I think that by using the Legal Term "NOTARY" in both
> >the WG's title and its operating practices, it opens the IETF to this
> >review.
> >
> >t.
> >
> >
> >
> >--
> >Todd S. Glassey
> >This is from my personal email account and any materials from this
> >account come with personal disclaimers.
> >
> >Further I OPT OUT of any and all commercial emailings.
> >
>
>
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