Re: [Ltru] clear guidance on tagging in cases involving a related macrolanguage

Felix Sasaki <fsasaki@w3.org> Fri, 23 May 2008 02:18 UTC

Return-Path: <ltru-bounces@ietf.org>
X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org
Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com
Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A83CD3A6BA4; Thu, 22 May 2008 19:18:17 -0700 (PDT)
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 223F63A6B7A for <ltru@core3.amsl.com>; Thu, 22 May 2008 19:18:16 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -0.09
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.09 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kgCm7UDHO6Os for <ltru@core3.amsl.com>; Thu, 22 May 2008 19:18:15 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from toro.w3.mag.keio.ac.jp (toro.w3.mag.keio.ac.jp [133.27.228.201]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21ABA3A6BA4 for <ltru@ietf.org>; Thu, 22 May 2008 19:18:14 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by toro.w3.mag.keio.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C5922BBF6; Fri, 23 May 2008 11:18:10 +0900 (JST)
Received: from toro.w3.mag.keio.ac.jp ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (toro.w3.mag.keio.ac.jp [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id L1MG3g08sNAn; Fri, 23 May 2008 11:18:10 +0900 (JST)
Received: from [127.0.0.1] (authserv3.mita.keio.ac.jp [131.113.199.45]) by toro.w3.mag.keio.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52DB62BBE7; Fri, 23 May 2008 11:18:10 +0900 (JST)
Message-ID: <48362950.9010904@w3.org>
Date: Fri, 23 May 2008 11:17:52 +0900
From: Felix Sasaki <fsasaki@w3.org>
User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: "Broome, Karen" <Karen_Broome@spe.sony.com>
References: <01c301c8bbe5$8c2810c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <30b660a20805221029k13cdb18asf31bcb6f9fc491a1@mail.gmail.com> <DDB6DE6E9D27DD478AE6D1BBBB83579562E2683F73@NA-EXMSG-C117.redmond.corp.microsoft.com> <C9BF0238EED3634BA1866AEF14C7A9E56157008C2B@NA-EXMSG-C116.redmond.corp.microsoft.com> <DDB6DE6E9D27DD478AE6D1BBBB83579562E2683FA7@NA-EXMSG-C117.redmond.corp.microsoft.com> <C9BF0238EED3634BA1866AEF14C7A9E56157008C4B@NA-EXMSG-C116.redmond.corp.microsoft.com> <E19FDBD7A3A7F04788F00E90915BD36C13C251B147@USSDIXMSG20.spe.sony.com> <DDB6DE6E9D27DD478AE6D1BBBB83579562E268407E@NA-EXMSG-C117.redmond.corp.microsoft.com> <E19FDBD7A3A7F04788F00E90915BD36C13C251B160@USSDIXMSG20.spe.sony.com>, <DDB6DE6E9D27DD478AE6D1BBBB83579562E268410A@NA-EXMSG-C117.redmond.corp.microsoft.com> <E19FDBD7A3A7F04788F00E90915BD36C13C2528A9E@USSDIXMSG20.spe.sony.com>
In-Reply-To: <E19FDBD7A3A7F04788F00E90915BD36C13C2528A9E@USSDIXMSG20.spe.sony.com>
Cc: "ltru@ietf.org" <ltru@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Ltru] clear guidance on tagging in cases involving a related macrolanguage
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list <ltru.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru>, <mailto:ltru-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/pipermail/ltru>
List-Post: <mailto:ltru@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ltru-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru>, <mailto:ltru-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org
Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org

Broome, Karen さんは書きました:
> I think extlang will likely be a cleaner solution to me than what you might offer, but I'm open to that as long as the preferred tagging and associated semantics are clear.
>   

this sounds like your vote

1: C
2: A

could also be

1: B (if there is a clear guidance on tagging in cases involving a related
macrolanguage available)
2: A

but given the long discussion about sec. 
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-14#section-4.1.1
it seems difficult to formulate that guidance.

Felix

> I think de-CH is a problem. I see more problems like this if we move forward extlangless with multiple "preferred" tag choices for the same thing and subjective distinctions. In the face of that, I start to like ISO 639-6.
>
> I *like* hierarchies.
>
> Karen
>
> ________________________________________
> From: Peter Constable [petercon@microsoft.com]
> Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2008 6:40 PM
> To: Broome, Karen
> Cc: LTRU Working Group
> Subject: RE: clear guidance on tagging in cases involving a related     macrolanguage
>
> Could you live without extlang provided those conditions were met, or do you think those conditions can't be met without extlang?
>
>
> Peter
>
>   
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Broome, Karen [mailto:Karen_Broome@spe.sony.com]
>> Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2008 5:01 PM
>> To: Peter Constable
>> Cc: LTRU Working Group
>> Subject: RE: clear guidance on tagging in cases involving a related
>> macrolanguage
>>
>> Yes, Peter.
>>
>>     
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf
>>> Of Peter Constable
>>> Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2008 4:58 PM
>>> To: LTRU Working Group
>>> Subject: [Ltru] clear guidance on tagging in cases involving a
>>> related macrolanguage
>>>
>>> [changing the subject per Randy's request]
>>>
>>>       
>>>> From: Broome, Karen [mailto:Karen_Broome@spe.sony.com]
>>>>         
>>>> Either way, zh-yue will remain valid, but not necessarily
>>>>         
>>> preferred.
>>>       
>>>> Having clear preferences is very important to me. I really don't
>>>>         
>>> want
>>>       
>>>> to recommend that people use "zh" for Mandarin or have to explain
>>>>         
>>> to
>>>       
>>>> someone why I think a deprecated tag is preferred in this industry
>>>>         
>>> but
>>>       
>>>> not others.
>>>>         
>>> And in another msg,
>>>
>>>       
>>>> I care more about identification than applications.
>>>>         
>>> So, it sounds to me like what you really care about are the
>>> following:
>>>
>>> - Don't have a recommendation "tag Madarin content as zh"
>>>
>>> - Have a single clear recommendation for how to tag each language
>>> (one or the other of "cmn" or "zh-cmn" for Mandarin would do).
>>>
>>>
>>> Is that right?
>>>
>>>
>>> Peter
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Ltru mailing list
>>> Ltru@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>>>       
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>   

_______________________________________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru