Re: [Ltru] Fw: I-D Action: draft-falk-transliteration-tags-01.txt

Mark Davis ☕ <mark@macchiato.com> Fri, 17 June 2011 21:07 UTC

Return-Path: <mark.edward.davis@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ltru@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA4F711E80EF for <ltru@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:07:51 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.792
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.792 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_FONT_FACE_BAD=0.884, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gQGn0nPcFz9P for <ltru@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:07:51 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-yx0-f172.google.com (mail-yx0-f172.google.com [209.85.213.172]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D83511E807F for <ltru@ietf.org>; Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:07:51 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by yxt33 with SMTP id 33so2391715yxt.31 for <ltru@ietf.org>; Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:07:50 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=sqlvEoNOvl5Ulf0nqVJT2o6Kh+FM8j67ZzxfoZ5cGEs=; b=A+eqSRxuRU5fanAgsxp6GUF4FbGNz9K1MKe+aIq0esmtGWwWSz9/zED9Uk007CX56Q wihTJ9NqWPvo1H791WgWcIKfqBO8EqSgyD9kxO3w47qVCRvtSZ8ZYSArbOZRy+LNt2tq XOYdII+6/+gvegFXaTnEM6jGd3SS93HReNsg4=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=borl9J4fpS0TgpiUfRCd8IEDc4cfM7U6RoOggpjushNLKv3ylBZu0RknFV8yHz8sHR WnJAZg3t7pVAgWkPYgE9zZjDY7ZrnagiIK6ZJxoyjNvH5itLmeJoYgoXYZx7clD7DO8a XBx6toDJKFYnKwr6wbKQBTmRs5T6rmiMyabDg=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.151.43.8 with SMTP id v8mr2874341ybj.296.1308344870448; Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:07:50 -0700 (PDT)
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.151.156.18 with HTTP; Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:07:50 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <003d01cc2b84$af13f560$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
References: <002701cc29f8$7c3e7d00$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <BANLkTinv4kB7X_hx6N7=B2-1QO8x3EoosA@mail.gmail.com> <4DF80CD1.1090907@it.aoyama.ac.jp> <000e01cc2b80$563628e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <2CB55BFC7405E94F830537BD924318D5EBF06DE3BF@USSDIXMSG11.am.sony.com> <003d01cc2b84$af13f560$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Date: Fri, 17 Jun 2011 14:07:50 -0700
X-Google-Sender-Auth: piLwsxBBiwqEhMTSkxmwGlUciJg
Message-ID: <BANLkTi=88jBLkn3eQM6OqALJt87B1APaWg@mail.gmail.com>
From: =?UTF-8?B?TWFyayBEYXZpcyDimJU=?= <mark@macchiato.com>
To: Randy Presuhn <randy_presuhn@mindspring.com>, court@infiauto.com
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=00151750d9e63f2f6104a5eec7d3
Cc: LTRU Working Group <ltru@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Fw: I-D Action: draft-falk-transliteration-tags-01.txt
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list <ltru.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ltru>, <mailto:ltru-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ltru>
List-Post: <mailto:ltru@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ltru-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru>, <mailto:ltru-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 17 Jun 2011 21:07:52 -0000

Yoshito, Addison, and I had had an action for a while now from the CLDR
committee to submit a draft for a an extension. Rather than go through all
the problems in the falk draft, we put together an alternative approach,
leveraging the work we already did for the -u- extension.

It just got posted at
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-davis-t-langtag-ext-00

Courtney, I think this provides a superset of the functionality that you are
interested in. Perhaps you can read it over, and we can add you as an author
of the next version of this draft instead of having the two competing
proposals.

Mark

*— Il meglio è l’inimico del bene —*


On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 10:50, Randy Presuhn
<randy_presuhn@mindspring.com>wrote;wrote:

> Hi -
>
> I started out with an off-list response, but I figure this is
> something worth sending to the list.
>
> Off-list, a contributor asked:
>
> ...
> > I'd love to see your input. I'd like to make sure I understand
> > all the concerns. Is there any way you could forward this to the list?
>
> My response:
>
> Sorry, already deleted.  As I recall, the main concerns were
>
>  (1) there already *is* support for identifying orthographies
>      (remember German?)
>  (2) the I-D seems to assume that transliterations always result
>      in "Latin" (previous discussion on LTRU included transliterations
>      to Cyrillic and Hangul, among others)
>  (3) the "original orthography" is irrelevant for the transliteration
>      systems I've been able to think of.  (At the same time, some
>      transliteration systems are quite "lossy" and some don't do
>      "round trip" very well.)  Consider also the transliteration of
> material
>      which was originally in audio form...
>  (4) The draft doesn't clearly distinguish "orthography" from
> "transliteration".
>      This may be because the boundary between the two can be fuzzy, but
> even
>      that is an issue that should be addressed.
>  (5) How this fits in with *transcription* systems (e.g. IPA) should be
>      addressed.  The boundary gets fuzzy with orthographies that are
> equivalent
>      to phonemic representations of the language.  (e.g., Pinyin for
> Mandarin)
>  (6) The proposed singleton usage appears broken and unnecessary.
>
> Or something like that.  I may have forgotten something here, or, in the
> process of reconstruction, thought of something I missed the first time.
>
> Randy
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>