Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and discovery (WAS: Re: notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88)
Henning Rogge <hrogge@googlemail.com> Fri, 15 November 2013 13:57 UTC
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From: Henning Rogge <hrogge@googlemail.com>
Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2013 14:57:15 +0100
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To: Rick Taylor <rick@tropicalstormsoftware.com>
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Cc: "DLEP Research Group (manet-dlep-rg@ietf.org)" <manet-dlep-rg@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and discovery (WAS: Re: notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88)
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And if the radio is directly (without a switch) connected to an interface of the router, there is not even a difference between unicast and multicast in terms of networking overhead. Henning Rogge On Fri, Nov 15, 2013 at 2:40 PM, Rick Taylor <rick@tropicalstormsoftware.com> wrote: > After a quick rant at a colleague, it has been pointed out that the fewer devices on the network throwing out discovery packets on multicast, the better. > > So perhaps the router should be the server. > > But, the multi-cast is link-local so there shouldn't be issues with flooding... > > Aaargh! > > ________________________________________ > From: manet-dlep-rg-bounces@ietf.org [manet-dlep-rg-bounces@ietf.org] on behalf of Taylor, Rick [Rick.Taylor@cassidian.com] > Sent: 15 November 2013 13:34 > Cc: DLEP Research Group (manet-dlep-rg@ietf.org); Dowdell, John > Subject: Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and discovery (WAS: Re: notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88) > > Okay, I'm wavering on this one. I've being thinking hard on this, and my opinion is changing. > > First off: > > Implementation issues are irrelevant in my opinion. We are all agreed that writing a TCP server or client is pretty much boiler-plate code. Modems have full TCP stacks, so do routers (I'm ignoring John's 802.15.4 question). > > And now my ramblings: > > The correct assignment of Server and Client roles should be driven by semantics of the roles, a server normally handles multiple conversations with many clients: HTTP, SNMP, SMTP, etc, etc... > > A server also 'serves' information to interested parties: "I have information, come get it" is a well-used paradigm. > > But, using these two suggested modes of operation gives two different answers: > > Routers (in general) will handle multiple sessions with modems, and modems (in general) will communicate with a single router. This implies that the Router should be the Server. > > However, Modems 'serve' DLEP information to routers; they have information for the router to come ask them about. This implies that the Modem should be the TCP server. The modem can decide how many sessions to accept and serve (generally 1). > > An important factor that I believe has not yet been addressed is that DLEP capable routers 'want' to create a DLEP session with a modem so they can perform their function, but a modem doesn't really care if anyone is receiving DLEP info. This leads me to suggest that a router should find out that there is a modem on an interface (it receives the discovery) and it then demands the DLEP session from the modem (i.e. It connects to the server in the modem). > > From a game-theory perspective (bear with me) the modem gets no benefit by connecting to an advertising router, and therefore may not, but a router does gain benefit and therefore can force the session creation by connecting. Therefore, the router should be the client. > > Aaaargh! I'm now arguing with myself! > > Rick > The information contained within this e-mail and any files attached to this e-mail is private and in addition may include commercially sensitive information. The contents of this e-mail are for the intended recipient only and therefore if you wish to disclose the information contained within this e-mail or attached files, please contact the sender prior to any such disclosure. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying or distribution is prohibited. Please also contact the sender and inform them of the error and delete the e-mail, including any attached files from your system. Cassidian Limited, Registered Office : Quadrant House, Celtic Springs, Coedkernew, Newport, NP10 8FZ Company No: 04191036 http://www.cassidian.com > _______________________________________________ > manet-dlep-rg mailing list > manet-dlep-rg@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet-dlep-rg > _______________________________________________ > manet-dlep-rg mailing list > manet-dlep-rg@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet-dlep-rg -- We began as wanderers, and we are wanderers still. We have lingered long enough on the shores of the cosmic ocean. We are ready at last to set sail for the stars - Carl Sagan
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Joe Macker
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Henning Rogge
- [manet-dlep-rg] Mandatory processing TLVs by rout… Teco Boot
- [manet-dlep-rg] Resources TLV Teco Boot
- [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Teco Boot
- [manet-dlep-rg] Rename Neighbor to Destination Teco Boot
- [manet-dlep-rg] Peer termination Teco Boot
- [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- [manet-dlep-rg] Multicast in dlep-04 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Resources TLV Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Peer termination Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Multicast in dlep-04 Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Mandatory processing TLVs by … Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Mandatory processing TLVs by … Henning Rogge
- [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Resources TLV Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Peer termination Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Mandatory processing TLVs by … Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Multicast in dlep-04 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Mandatory processing TLVs by … Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Peer termination Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Resources TLV Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Resources TLV Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Peer termination Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Peer termination Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Taylor, Rick
- [manet-dlep-rg] Draft-04 text Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Peer termination Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Draft-04 text Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Draft-04 text Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP TLV length Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Mandatory processing TLVs by … Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Mandatory processing TLVs by … Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP TLV length Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Mandatory processing TLVs by … Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Resources TLV Ulrich Herberg
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Martin Duke
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Resources TLV Ulrich Herberg
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Latency Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Mandatory processing TLVs by … Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Dowdell, John
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Dowdell, John
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] Resources TLV Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP session establishment Teco Boot
- [manet-dlep-rg] manet-dlep-rg: Martin's membership Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] manet-dlep-rg: Martin's membe… Ulrich Herberg
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] manet-dlep-rg: Martin's membe… Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address John Dowdell
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Teco Boot
- [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Duke, Martin
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Duke, Martin
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Duke, Martin
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Duke, Martin
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Duke, Martin
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Duke, Martin
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] manet-dlep-rg: Martin's membe… Duke, Martin
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Martin Duke
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Martin Duke
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Rick Taylor
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Rick Taylor
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Rick Taylor
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Rick Taylor
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Rick Taylor
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] notes DLEP meeting @ IETF88 Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Martin Duke
- [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and discove… Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… John Dowdell
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… John Dowdell
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Taylor, Rick
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Henning Rogge
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Rick Taylor
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Stan Ratliff (sratliff)
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] TCP clients, servers, and dis… Teco Boot
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Martin Duke
- Re: [manet-dlep-rg] DLEP multicast address Stan Ratliff (sratliff)