Re: [manet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-manet-dlep-pause-extension-06: (with DISCUSS)

Lou Berger <> Thu, 04 April 2019 15:56 UTC

Return-Path: <>
Received: from localhost (localhost []) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FC8B120121 for <>; Thu, 4 Apr 2019 08:56:59 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.901
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (768-bit key)
Received: from ([]) by localhost ( []) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WJUeTq2J8Kia for <>; Thu, 4 Apr 2019 08:56:54 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ( []) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 97E7112007A for <>; Thu, 4 Apr 2019 08:56:54 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from (unknown []) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB4841E0BDE for <>; Thu, 4 Apr 2019 09:56:53 -0600 (MDT)
Received: from ([]) by cmsmtp with ESMTP id C4jThCXYLuj2oC4jTh9NxB; Thu, 04 Apr 2019 09:56:51 -0600
X-Authority-Reason: nr=8
X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=ePE9ckh1 c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=h1BC+oY+fLhyFmnTBx92Jg==:117 a=h1BC+oY+fLhyFmnTBx92Jg==:17 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10:nop_charset_1 a=xqWC_Br6kY4A:10:nop_ipv6 a=oexKYjalfGEA:10:nop_rcvd_month_year a=48vgC7mUAAAA:8 a=jB8uovYwWA93GjEbXJAA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10:nop_charset_2 a=mYAOWqAtFUkA:10:demote_hacked_domain_1 a=1dbGxDndw2gA:10:demote_hacked_domain_7 a=w1C3t2QeGrPiZgrLijVG:22
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed;; s=default; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version :Date:Message-ID:From:References:Cc:To:Subject:Sender:Reply-To:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe: List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=jPxvVccER2PhNHzeE4/BagknIWTjDKFNWd041E1DEUc=; b=XY+fk/0ahl61m0KHOpub2zDyVZ rTZ0wS8E9feHKktvivh26sOukx/Fh0Ap6QNdrwxJSti1jZyHY5d7wTGWidBhu1c5V4TL6Hcz43ufu FAls91rmP3hsXO69zi9olA06n;
Received: from ([]:46952 helo=[IPv6:::1]) by with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.91) (envelope-from <>) id 1hC4jT-001y3p-2c; Thu, 04 Apr 2019 09:56:51 -0600
To: Magnus Westerlund <>, The IESG <>
References: <>
From: Lou Berger <>
Message-ID: <>
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2019 11:56:50 -0400
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.3.1
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Content-Language: en-US
X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report
X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname -
X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain -
X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12]
X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain -
X-BWhitelist: no
X-Source-L: No
X-Exim-ID: 1hC4jT-001y3p-2c
X-Source-Sender: ([IPv6:::1]) []:46952
X-Email-Count: 12
X-Source-Cap: bGFibm1vYmk7bGFibm1vYmk7Ym94MzEzLmJsdWVob3N0LmNvbQ==
X-Local-Domain: yes
Archived-At: <>
Subject: Re: [manet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-manet-dlep-pause-extension-06: (with DISCUSS)
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks <>
List-Unsubscribe: <>, <>
List-Archive: <>
List-Post: <>
List-Help: <>
List-Subscribe: <>, <>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2019 15:56:59 -0000


On 4/4/2019 7:42 AM, Magnus Westerlund via Datatracker wrote:
> Magnus Westerlund has entered the following ballot position for
> draft-ietf-manet-dlep-pause-extension-06: Discuss
> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> introductory paragraph, however.)
> Please refer to
> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> It is unclear to me what the purpose of the pause and resume is here?
> Is it to enable the router to build the queue rather than the modem if there is
> a queue buildup in the modem?

Yes and also allow a router to implement more sophisticated queuing if 
it so chooses, e.g., mapping multiple DHCPs into a single modem queue.

>   If that is the case, then pause and resume will
> be done frequently and on short time scales due to variability of the link. And
> then the router resumes transmission to the modem when the buffer has been
> reduced?

Also correct.  Fundamentally this is the same as what was defined 
previously for PPPoE in RFC5578, but using a simpler on/off mechanism 
and DLEP.  DLEP is the replacement for using PPPoE for radio to router 

> As this is enabled to be done on a queue level what how does one
> ensure the per hop behavior that is intended based on the DSCP with this split.
> Because you will get an interaction between the two queue that are in series
> for the same link which makes ensuring the PHB difficult.

I agree that there are two queues in series, but don't see this as 
materially different than what RFC5578 allowed or 2 routers 
interconnected over a link that supports normal Ethernet pause or PFC.  
In other words, I see that a modem that is DSCP aware must conform with 
the same requirements as a router that is DSCP aware.

At least this is my option.  Others may see it differently, e.g., Stan 
(who co-authored RFC5578 and is the doc Shepherd) or the others in the 
WG who have been working radio/router interfaces for far longer than I 


> I hope for a timely clarification to determine if this is a discuss or not and
> make it more actionable.
> _______________________________________________
> manet mailing list