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Re: [MBONED] deprecating MSDP

Leonard Giuliano <lenny@juniper.net> Thu, 07 September 2017 18:33 UTC

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Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2017 11:33:40 -0700
From: Leonard Giuliano <lenny@juniper.net>
To: Mikael Abrahamsson <swmike@swm.pp.se>
CC: Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de>, "mboned@ietf.org" <mboned@ietf.org>
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References: <20170725221330.GA4821@cs-it-6805697.local> <alpine.DEB.2.02.1707260908550.29724@svl-jtac-lnx02> <20170904141235.GC3194@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <alpine.DEB.2.02.1709051358300.14937@svl-jtac-lnx02.juniper.net> <f911d57bf77245b8b074d3c557ab28f2@XCH15-06-11.nw.nos.boeing.com> <alpine.DEB.2.20.1709060825330.29378@uplift.swm.pp.se> <20170907134500.GB23219@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <alpine.DEB.2.20.1709071602420.29378@uplift.swm.pp.se>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/mboned/Y5SOQxRzrdDXMvcxfN2KpK1ek8s>
Subject: Re: [MBONED] deprecating MSDP
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| Indeed not solved by "just use SSM". It is still my firm opinion that there
| will be no "IP multicast service across the Internet" unless someone comes up
| with serious money and throws it ISPs way to enable this. And I am talking
| about ALL the ISPs which carry this, not just one. I don't see this happening
| anytime soon.

FWIW, we wouldn't have the web or netflix or youtube or any of the main 
things that people use the Internet for if such a similar barrier were 
considered for these services.  Content drives deployment.  If mcast is 
able to deliver some really compelling content that isn't available/viable 
via unicast, then it will find a way to get itself deployed.  VR perhaps?  
Anyway, the bar for this to happen is actually much lower now that we have 
AMT, as it only takes one/a few SPs to deploy Internet Mcast to deliver 
the content to end users, as opposed to ~ALL of them as was previously 
required.

FWIW2, all of the exact same arguments for/against mcast can be made for 
IPv6, and IPv6 seems to gaining a bit of momentum and steam after a few 
decades of similar deployment malaise.  Perhaps v6 can provide a teachable 
moment for mcast?

As for business models, anyone seeking massive $$$ for direct revenue from 
Internet mcast will most likely never find it.  I think mcast is best 
viewed like DNS or BGP (or IPv6)- infrastructure that is difficult to 
charge directly for, but enables higher layer services for which there is 
a panoply of viable business models.

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