Re: [MMUSIC] Merging ICE aggressive and regular nomination (was Re: [tram] Comment on draft-williams-peer-redirect-01: might it not converge?)

Jonathan Lennox <jonathan@vidyo.com> Wed, 30 July 2014 22:51 UTC

Return-Path: <jonathan@vidyo.com>
X-Original-To: mmusic@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: mmusic@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD9021A0097 for <mmusic@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 30 Jul 2014 15:51:15 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.831
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.831 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_SORBS_WEB=0.77, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xEAcVopA7hTz for <mmusic@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 30 Jul 2014 15:51:14 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from server209.appriver.com (server209c.appriver.com [8.31.233.118]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C53F21A00AD for <mmusic@ietf.org>; Wed, 30 Jul 2014 15:51:13 -0700 (PDT)
X-Note-AR-ScanTimeLocal: 7/30/2014 6:51:10 PM
X-Policy: GLOBAL - vidyo.com
X-Policy: GLOBAL - vidyo.com
X-Policy: GLOBAL - vidyo.com
X-Primary: jonathan@vidyo.com
X-Note: This Email was scanned by AppRiver SecureTide
X-Virus-Scan: V-
X-Note-SnifferID: 0
X-Note: TCH-CT/SI:0-56/SG:2 7/30/2014 6:50:18 PM
X-GBUdb-Analysis: 0, 162.209.16.213, Ugly c=0.901204 p=-0.977711 Source White
X-Signature-Violations: 0-0-0-4858-c
X-Note-419: 0 ms. Fail:0 Chk:1335 of 1335 total
X-Note: SCH-CT/SI:0-1335/SG:1 7/30/2014 6:51:09 PM
X-Note: Spam Tests Failed:
X-Country-Path: ->UNITED STATES->
X-Note-Sending-IP: 162.209.16.213
X-Note-Reverse-DNS: mail1.vidyo.com
X-Note-Return-Path: jonathan@vidyo.com
X-Note: User Rule Hits:
X-Note: Global Rule Hits: G335 G336 G337 G338 G342 G343 G453
X-Note: Encrypt Rule Hits:
X-Note: Mail Class: VALID
X-Note: Headers Injected
Received: from [162.209.16.213] (HELO mail.vidyo.com) by server209.appriver.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.8) with ESMTPS id 117165728; Wed, 30 Jul 2014 18:51:10 -0400
Received: from 492133-EXCH2.vidyo.com ([fe80::50:56ff:fe85:6b62]) by 492132-EXCH1.vidyo.com ([fe80::50:56ff:fe85:4f77%13]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Wed, 30 Jul 2014 17:51:09 -0500
From: Jonathan Lennox <jonathan@vidyo.com>
To: Martin Thomson <martin.thomson@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: [MMUSIC] Merging ICE aggressive and regular nomination (was Re: [tram] Comment on draft-williams-peer-redirect-01: might it not converge?)
Thread-Index: AQHPrAhtxaTuo9vyTE6R2p2YHkJufJu5biYAgAAEI4CAAAyGAIAABf0AgAACF4CAAAZeAA==
Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2014 22:51:08 +0000
Message-ID: <2512D364-E653-4363-8642-9D8EA1A3408C@vidyo.com>
References: <0DA61D09-6491-4DA4-8B6F-CFED70584A76@vidyo.com> <CAOJ7v-1jLK7dWDkWHKwHJ6qXicZWDNrAqOtw9R=6zAcWzkh5+g@mail.gmail.com> <53D796E5.9040009@jive.com> <2AF26344-DF5D-493C-96BC-80AD7DF35444@vidyo.com> <CAOJ7v-0HEjQQ+j0cAVc5r3Y4LxaoGF7EN2twGG6vTuMmEeragQ@mail.gmail.com> <8D2E9E91-B0B7-4081-B65B-EDAEC4D23A97@vidyo.com> <CAOJ7v-1HzGoUNXjvXph0-8WfpM6-vFJ+yDWhVw1_1grfrVD1Vw@mail.gmail.com> <B2794643-ADB5-4B66-98DC-841990C85437@vidyo.com> <CAOJ7v-2O3TwNcsKqp48PjDRu+Yu_+jEurecbO2GctD4Hsuu+NA@mail.gmail.com> <48776423-8594-4133-BD23-3EA561EC2A9D@vidyo.com> <CABkgnnXHYZ-L1LGhFnzFyV00xkgafuX7EOUSt6LCaRg=iv0VSQ@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CABkgnnXHYZ-L1LGhFnzFyV00xkgafuX7EOUSt6LCaRg=iv0VSQ@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-originating-ip: [160.79.219.114]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
Content-ID: <5EE145F3AED7D647845DA61599322F9F@vidyo.com>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/mmusic/CFQyOlA-Pq7WWLvAsTZpde1pYVM
Cc: mmusic <mmusic@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [MMUSIC] Merging ICE aggressive and regular nomination (was Re: [tram] Comment on draft-williams-peer-redirect-01: might it not converge?)
X-BeenThere: mmusic@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Multiparty Multimedia Session Control Working Group <mmusic.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/mmusic>, <mailto:mmusic-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/mmusic/>
List-Post: <mailto:mmusic@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:mmusic-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mmusic>, <mailto:mmusic-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2014 22:51:15 -0000

On Jul 30, 2014, at 6:28 PM, Martin Thomson <martin.thomson@gmail.com> wrote:

> On 30 July 2014 15:20, Jonathan Lennox <jonathan@vidyo.com> wrote:
>> 
>> I don’t think you want a rule of “most recently received USE-CANDIDATE” to
>> determine the selected pair.  Checks will race each other, especially when
>> the paths’ RTTs are very different.
>> 
>> In my model, there is only ever one USE-CANDIDATE sent per component — i.e.,
>> it works like pure regular nomination, except for the “early media”.
> 
> If the controlled peer really does use this as a signal that it's safe
> to close out other candidates, then you really do have to have just
> the one instance.  Is attaching that semantic safe?  I assume that we
> would have to signal in both directions that this new meaning is
> acceptable first.  (a=ice-options again)

5245 8.3.1:
   Once ICE processing
   has reached the Completed state for all peers for media streams using
   those candidates, the agent SHOULD wait an additional three seconds,
   and then it MAY cease responding to checks or generating triggered
   checks on that candidate.  It MAY free the candidate at that time.
You enter the “Completed” state once all components of all streams have sent or received (as appropriate) USE-CANDIDATE.

The “all peers” clause is needed for SIP, to handle forking cases.  For non-forking uses of ICE, “all peers” is equivalent to “the peer”.