IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [Model-t] w3c also thinking about threat models

Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie> Fri, 20 September 2019 20:01 UTC

Return-Path: <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
X-Original-To: model-t@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: model-t@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B8A11208BC for <model-t@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 20 Sep 2019 13:01:53 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -4.299
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.299 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cs.tcd.ie
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vEIaBFc-mmiJ for <model-t@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 20 Sep 2019 13:01:51 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mercury.scss.tcd.ie (mercury.scss.tcd.ie [134.226.56.6]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AE4E2120099 for <model-t@iab.org>; Fri, 20 Sep 2019 13:01:50 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mercury.scss.tcd.ie (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEA06BE2C; Fri, 20 Sep 2019 21:01:47 +0100 (IST)
X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at scss.tcd.ie
Received: from mercury.scss.tcd.ie ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mercury.scss.tcd.ie [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ho9I__d88Gku; Fri, 20 Sep 2019 21:01:46 +0100 (IST)
Received: from [10.244.2.138] (95-45-153-252-dynamic.agg2.phb.bdt-fng.eircom.net [95.45.153.252]) by mercury.scss.tcd.ie (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id F3B0DBE24; Fri, 20 Sep 2019 21:01:45 +0100 (IST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cs.tcd.ie; s=mail; t=1569009706; bh=o5wOQQMlXBpQa6zBWde9uUWmCwFtnrCT9JBXogFbjAk=; h=Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=lq0Q07gWQ57oZ/l+e0ceCVEV3Yi9b8STh55FW3NgG+9RmQsM2ovYKE1Y+/V+Asver p5lYD3LaIEcpIDRMBv5hHr+JVDKDkGBXTZu8X6HiH7t7cczQ/na8shorhw+YK+lUxf u8Fya53tlOcF3vTKITIMMvfUHRoOzem7OMHhQ8RI=
To: Bret Jordan <jordan.ietf@gmail.com>, Dominique Lazanski <dml@lastpresslabel.com>
Cc: model-t@iab.org
References: <a327c668-6a17-bb9f-318e-e3cea6c6c1d0@cs.tcd.ie> <624F4CA6-8D84-4BD8-A74C-E5AE22709F72@lastpresslabel.com> <A30308F8-D2A5-45CF-88D9-D65240972D51@gmail.com>
From: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
Openpgp: id=5BB5A6EA5765D2C5863CAE275AB2FAF17B172BEA; url=
Autocrypt: addr=stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQINBFo9UDIBEADUH4ZPcUnX5WWRWO4kEkHea5Y5eEvZjSwe/YA+G0nrTuOU9nemCP5PMvmh 5Cg8gBTyWyN4Z2+O25p9Tja5zUb+vPMWYvOtokRrp46yhFZOmiS5b6kTq0IqYzsEv5HI58S+ QtaFq978CRa4xH9Gi9u4yzUmT03QNIGDXE37honcAM4MOEtEgvw4fVhVWJuyy3w//0F2tzKr EMjmL5VGuD/Q9+G/7abuXiYNNd9ZFjv4625AUWwy+pAh4EKzS1FE7BOZp9daMu9MUQmDqtZU bUv0Q+DnQAB/4tNncejJPz0p2z3MWCp5iSwHiQvytYgatMp34a50l6CWqa13n6vY8VcPlIqO Vz+7L+WiVfxLbeVqBwV+4uL9to9zLF9IyUvl94lCxpscR2kgRgpM6A5LylRDkR6E0oudFnJg b097ZaNyuY1ETghVB5Uir1GCYChs8NUNumTHXiOkuzk+Gs4DAHx/a78YxBolKHi+esLH8r2k 4LyM2lp5FmBKjG7cGcpBGmWavACYEa7rwAadg4uBx9SHMV5i33vDXQUZcmW0vslQ2Is02NMK 7uB7E7HlVE1IM1zNkVTYYGkKreU8DVQu8qNOtPVE/CdaCJ/pbXoYeHz2B1Nvbl9tlyWxn5Xi HzFPJleXc0ksb9SkJokAfwTSZzTxeQPER8la5lsEEPbU/cDTcwARAQABtDJTdGVwaGVuIEZh cnJlbGwgKDIwMTcpIDxzdGVwaGVuLmZhcnJlbGxAY3MudGNkLmllPokCQAQTAQgAKgIbAwUJ CZQmAAULCQgHAgYVCAkKCwIEFgIDAQIeAQIXgAUCWj6jdwIZAQAKCRBasvrxexcr6o7QD/9m x9DPJetmW794RXmNTrbTJ44zc/tJbcLdRBh0KBn9OW/EaAqjDmgNJeCMyJTKr1ywaps8HGUN hLEVkc14NUpgi4/Zkrbi3DmTp25OHj6wXBS5qVMyVynTMEIjOfeFFyxG+48od+Xn7qg6LT7G rHeNf+z/r0v9+8eZ1Ip63kshQDGhhpmRMKu4Ws9ZvTW2ACXkkTFaSGYJj3yIP4R6IgwBYGMz DXFX6nS4LA1s3pcPNxOgrvCyb60AiJZTLcOk/rRrpZtXB1XQc23ZZmrlTkl2HaThL6w3YKdi Ti1NbuMeOxZqtXcUshII45sANm4HuWNTiRh93Bn5bN6ddjgsaXEZBKUBuUaPBl7gQiQJcAlS 3MmGgVS4ZoX8+VaPGpXdQVFyBMRFlOKOC5XJESt7wY0RE2C8PFm+5eywSO/P1fkl9whkMgml 3OEuIQiP2ehRt/HVLMHkoM9CPQ7t6UwdrXrvX+vBZykav8x9U9M6KTgfsXytxUl6Vx5lPMLi 2/Jrsz6Mzh/IVZa3xjhq1OLFSI/tT2ji4FkJDQbO+yYUDhcuqfakDmtWLMxecZsY6O58A/95 8Qni6Xeq+Nh7zJ7wNcQOMoDGj+24di2TX1cKLzdDMWFaWzlNP5dB5VMwS9Wqj1Z6TzKjGjru q8soqohwb2CK9B3wzFg0Bs1iBI+2RuFnxLkCDQRaPVAyARAA+g3R0HzGr/Dl34Y07XqGqzq5 SU0nXIu9u8Ynsxj7gR5qb3HgUWYEWrHW2jHOByXnvkffucf5yzwrsvw8Q8iI8CFHiTYHPpey 4yPVn6R0w/FOMcY70eTIu/k6EEFDlDbs09DtKcrsT9bmN0XoRxITlXwWTufYqUnmS+YkAuk+ TLCtUin7OdaS2uU6Ata3PLQSeM2ZsUQMmYmHPwB9rmf+q2I005AJ9Q1SPQ2KNg/8xOGxo13S VuaSqYRQdpV93RuCOzg4vuXtR+gP0KQrus/P2ZCEPvU9cXF/2MIhXgOz207lv3iE2zGyNXld /n8spvWk+0bH5Zqd9Wcba/rGcBhmX9NKKDARZqjkv/zVEP1X97w1HsNYeUFNcg2lk9zQKb4v l1jx/Uz8ukzH2QNhU4R39dbF/4AwWuSVkGW6bTxHJqGs6YimbfdQqxTzmqFwz3JP0OtXX5q/ 6D4pHwcmJwEiDNzsBLl6skPSQ0Xyq3pua/qAP8MVm+YxCxJQITqZ8qjDLzoe7s9X6FLLC/DA L9kxl5saVSfDbuI3usH/emdtn0NA9/M7nfgih92zD92sl1yQXHT6BDa8xW1j+RU4P+E0wyd7 zgB2UeYgrp2IIcfG+xX2uFG5MJQ/nYfBoiALb0+dQHNHDtFnNGY3Oe8z1M9c5aDG3/s29QbJ +w7hEKKo9YMAEQEAAYkCJQQYAQgADwUCWj1QMgIbDAUJCZQmAAAKCRBasvrxexcr6qwvD/9b Rek3kfN8Q+jGrKl8qwY8HC5s4mhdDJZI/JP2FImf5J2+d5/e8UJ4fcsT79E0/FqX3Z9wZr6h sofPqLh1/YzDsYkZDHTYSGrlWGP/I5kXwUmFnBZHzM3WGrL3S7ZmCYMdudhykxXXjq7M6Do1 oxM8JofrXGtwBTLv5wfvvygJouVCVe87Ge7mCeY5vey1eUi4zSSF1zPpR6gg64w2g4TXM5qt SwkZVOv1g475LsGlYWRuJV8TA67yp1zJI7HkNqCo8KyHX0DPOh9c+Sd9ZX4aqKfqH9HIpnCL AYEgj7vofeix7gM3kQQmwynqq32bQGQBrKJEYp2vfeO30VsVx4dzuuiC5lyjUccVmw5D72J0 FlGrfEm0kw6D1qwyBg0SAMqamKN6XDdjhNAtXIaoA2UMZK/vZGGUKbqTgDdk0fnzOyb2zvXK CiPFKqIPAqKaDHg0JHdGI3KpQdRNLLzgx083EqEc6IAwWA6jSz+6lZDV6XDgF0lYqAYIkg3+ 6OUXUv6plMlwSHquiOc/MQXHfgUP5//Ra5JuiuyCj954FD+MBKIj8eWROfnzyEnBplVHGSDI ZLzL3pvV14dcsoajdeIH45i8DxnVm64BvEFHtLNlnliMrLOrk4shfmWyUqNlzilXN2BTFVFH 4MrnagFdcFnWYp1JPh96ZKjiqBwMv/H0kw==
Message-ID: <27c70832-a631-4622-6119-3a47928c634e@cs.tcd.ie>
Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2019 21:01:43 +0100
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.8.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <A30308F8-D2A5-45CF-88D9-D65240972D51@gmail.com>
Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha512"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="vxrVDr1jkGFegQaPV1zJekGVXLpcbXvRN"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/model-t/-lUTX-WIw6jHhCLqOrtsXYeqEvM>
Subject: Re: [Model-t] w3c also thinking about threat models
X-BeenThere: model-t@iab.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: Discussions of changes in Internet deployment patterns and their impact on the Internet threat model <model-t.iab.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.iab.org/mailman/options/model-t>, <mailto:model-t-request@iab.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/model-t/>
List-Post: <mailto:model-t@iab.org>
List-Help: <mailto:model-t-request@iab.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.iab.org/mailman/listinfo/model-t>, <mailto:model-t-request@iab.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2019 20:01:54 -0000

On 20/09/2019 18:48, Bret Jordan wrote:
> Yes, privacy is just one facet. 

Sure, it's clearly true that privacy is not everything
in the IETF context, nor in w3c either. I guess the
argument for putting more focus on privacy in w3c might
be that the web has a reasonably worked out, (even if
imperfect) security model (the SOP etc), but that the
web has been pretty awful for privacy. Well, that's an
argument I'd make, not sure if the people involved in
the w3c work would:-)

S.

> 
> 
> Thanks,
> Bret
> PGP Fingerprint: 63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447  F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 0050
> "Without cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thing that can not be unscrambled is an egg."
> 
>> On Sep 20, 2019, at 11:12 AM, Dominique Lazanski <dml@lastpresslabel.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> On 20 Sep 2019, at 11:26, Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Hiya,
>>>
>>> Hope we all had a nice summer break from this
>>> discussion, but I'd like to try see if we can
>>> get back at it, so I've added reviewing the
>>> various drafts folks have posted to my todo
>>> list - I hope to send some comments/reviews
>>> in the next week-ish.
>>>
>>> In the meantime, it looks like w3c are also
>>> thinking about threat models [1] which is
>>> interesting.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> S.
>>
>> Thanks for kick starting this list again especially after the summer!
>>
>> Interesting W3C work, but I would add that they are only looking at privacy threat models so they have that covered. Perhaps we should look at system security threat models since W3C has kicked off their work specifically on privacy. That way we can be more holistic about the work.
>>
>> Looking forward to the discussions.
>>
>> Dominique
>>
>> -- 
>> Model-t mailing list
>> Model-t@iab.org
>> https://www.iab.org/mailman/listinfo/model-t
> 
> 
>

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email