Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect
Eric Rescorla <ekr@rtfm.com> Sun, 04 August 2019 05:08 UTC
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From: Eric Rescorla <ekr@rtfm.com>
Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2019 22:08:04 -0700
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To: Bret Jordan <jordan.ietf@gmail.com>
Cc: Christian Huitema <huitema@huitema.net>, model-t@iab.org
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Subject: Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect
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his seems like a reasonable problem statement for the overall problem of computer security, but not really for IETF. To take a concrete example memory reading attacks like Spectre are a threat to user data and something that browser vendors spend a fair amount of energy working on, but they're mostly not in scope for IETF [0]. There's nothing wrong with that, it's just division of labor. -Ekr [0] I say "mostly" because (a) we need to take the security implications of these kinds of attacks in our protocol designs and (b) there might be some small pieces of IETF work like CORB, though that seems to be mostly being done elsewhere. On Sat, Aug 3, 2019 at 2:47 PM Bret Jordan <jordan.ietf@gmail.com> wrote: > Protection of end users’ data > > Protection of an organization’s data > > Protection of devices owned by an end user or an organization > > Protection of network equipment > > Protection of SCADA system > > Protection of critical infrastructure > > Protection of IoT and soon to be released 5G devices > > Protection of cost optimized controllers > > > The problem we have had in the past is we want to call this one of the > following, but each one does not encompass the full picture. > 1) Computer security > 2) Data security > 3) Information security > 4) Communication security > 5) Network security > 6) Application security > Etc, etc, > > So if you way we are just dealing with communication security or > information security we are missing a significant piece of the pie. > > > Thanks, > Bret > PGP Fingerprint: 63B4 FC53 680A 6B7D 1447 F2C0 74F8 ACAE 7415 0050 > "Without cryptography vihv vivc ce xhrnrw, however, the only thing that > can not be unscrambled is an egg." > > > Reading this thread, I think that we are missing a step. We cannot > define attacks without defining first the assets that need to be > protected. Different actors probably have different views on that, such as: > > 1) Continuous operation of the Internet > > 2) Continuous operation of a specific Internet provider > > 3) Continuous availability of an Internet Service > > 4) Continuous connectivity for a given user > > 5) Protection of databases used by services and enterprises > > 6) Protection of the personal data of users > > Do we have agreement on what we are trying to protect? > > -- Christian Huitema > > > -- > Model-t mailing list > Model-t@iab.org > https://www.iab.org/mailman/listinfo/model-t > > > -- > Model-t mailing list > Model-t@iab.org > https://www.iab.org/mailman/listinfo/model-t >
- [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Michael Richardson
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Joseph Lorenzo Hall
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Michael Richardson
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Martin Thomson
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Eric Rescorla
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Jim Fenton
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Ted Lemon
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Christian Huitema
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Watson Ladd
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Carsten Bormann
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Ted Lemon
- [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] model-t@iab.org list description Watson Ladd
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Eric Rescorla
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Dominique Lazanski
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Eric Rescorla
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Dominique Lazanski
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Eric Rescorla
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Watson Ladd
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Ted Lemon
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Dominique Lazanski
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Ted Lemon
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Christian Huitema
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Ted Lemon
- [Model-t] Primer Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Christian Huitema
- Re: [Model-t] Primer Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Bret Jordan
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Watson Ladd
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Thomas Hardjono
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Ira McDonald
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Thomas Hardjono
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Watson Ladd
- Re: [Model-t] What are we trying to protect Thomas Hardjono