Re: [Mops] Draft minutes from 2020-Apr interim
Spencer Dawkins at IETF <spencerdawkins.ietf@gmail.com> Wed, 22 April 2020 14:46 UTC
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From: Spencer Dawkins at IETF <spencerdawkins.ietf@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2020 09:45:35 -0500
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To: Kyle Rose <krose@krose.org>
Cc: mops@ietf.org
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Subject: Re: [Mops] Draft minutes from 2020-Apr interim
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Hi, Kyle, On Wed, Apr 22, 2020 at 7:52 AM Kyle Rose <krose@krose.org> wrote: > I've pasted the draft minutes from our Ides of April interim below. Thanks > again to Olufemi Komolafe for volunteering! Please review and provide > clarifications and/or corrections to the chairs. Otherwise, we'll be > posting the minutes to the data tracker in a week at which point it will be > part of your Permanent Record. > Thanks for the excellent start on minutes. I have a couple of notes below. Best, Spencer > Kyle > > > > > > Media OPerationS (MOPS) WG > > April 2020 Virtual Interim > Wednesday, April 15, 2020 20h00UTC-21h30UTC > > Webex details below > > Agenda > > Intro > > Agenda Bashing [5min] chair(s) > > Review of concrete work items: > > [15min] Draft of edge network operational considerations for streaming > media > Jake Holland > draft-ietf-mops-streaming-opcons > Github - https://github.com/ietf-wg-mops/draft-ietf-mops-streaming-opcons > Accepting comments via GitHub issues > Presented update on draft > Discussion on “Soliciting Contributions - Proposed Template” > + have in current draft or perhaps produce new draft (BCP?) > Matt Stock: Like template and sees potential > Jake Holland: Appreciates feedback. Potential to write diffrent BCPs, > targeted at diffrent audience > Spencer Dawkins: Aim is for draft to not only call out potential bad > things but rather try to be actionable, hence why mitigations are solicited > Glenn Deen: +1 on collecting mitigations and sees potential in this > highlighting potential areas of interest/work. Mitigations are only a first > step, and where there are really egregious problems the mitigation may be a > temporary approach and the issue may trigger additional work relevant to > the IETF. > Matt Stock: Mitigations may not be black/white but rather may involve > tradeoffs which should be called out to inform decision-making > Leslie Daigle: Maybe collect the issues as a starting point > Spencer Dawkins: Thanks to both Glenn and Matt for these excellent > suggestions > Updates from elsewhere > > Updates from other work > [15min] Sanjay Mishra - anything from SVA Open Caching WG > Described significant impact COVID-19 having on video traffic seeing by > carriers > Discussed ongoing and potential work of interest in SVA and potential new > working groups > Glenn Deen: Recent work in SVA working group on media use cases for > multicast streaming that may be of interest > Jake Holland: Work looks interesting. What does engagement with SVA look > like? SVA members commenting on IETF mailing list? Interested to hear more > about the multicast work > Sanjay Mishra: Perhaps bring back updates/proble statements etc from SVA > to IETF, IETF can work on these items and perhaps SVA consumes the output > Spencer Dawkins: Thanks for discussion on COVID-19 impact on video > traffic. > This could be "Thanks for discussion on COVID-19 impact on video traffic, with references. draft-ietf-mops-streaming-opcons now has a section on "Unpredictable Usage Profiles", and the authors have been talking about mentioning COVID-19 as well. > Glenn Deen: Address potential issue regarding IPR raised by Jake Holland. > There should be no issues - SVA docs are published on the web for all to > read and IP issues shouldn't enter into MOPS working with SVA use csses. If > still concerned, please come talk to glenn.deen@nbcuni.com - I'm on the > SVA board. > > > > [5min] Glenn Deen -- anything further re SMPTE > > > [15min] Maxim Sharabayko SRT — see > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-sh arabayko-mops-srt/ , posted on > MOPS mailing list > Overview of potential benefits SRT > Jake Holland: Questions about protocol and operational use. Suitable for > contribution/distribution or livestreaming to end-users? > Max Sharabayko: SRT is well-suited for media > Marc Cymontkowski: Use of UDP means not SRT is not direct > What other protocols were considered and what was deficient about them? > Marc Cymontkowski: Original goal was to transmit live stream over public > internet. Came to problem with clean slate and started with UDP and added > enhancements to make it more suited for real-time traffic. > Kyle Rose: With hindsight, starting off with RTP may have been a better > option at the start, a few years ago. > Glenn Deen: Comcast use SRT significantly and so keen for this work to > succeed. What are the current priorities for RTP? > Marc Cymontkowski: Redundancy, balancing data of multiple links, > congestion control > Glenn Denn: Congestion control of interest - as playing nicely with the > network is in everyone's best interest > Leslie Daigle: Potential interest in this WG in this protocol. Detailed > protocol machinery discussions will be done in other WGs but MOPS interested > Spencer Dawkins: An Independent Stream draft on SRT as it exists today > will be of great value to MOPS, because we would have a good reference for > the protocol as we start to make recommendations on use of SRT for > streaming operators. That was the recommendation for a first step from > Dispatch discussion on SRT as I understood it, although the current IESG > might change that recommendation. > My last sentence would be clearer as "That was the recommendation for a first step from Dispatch discussion on SRT as I understood it, although the final direction would be up to the responsible area directors".. > > Alex Gouaillard: Discussion in other WGs regarding SRT, especially > concerns regarding security > - When presented at IETF dispatch, concerned were expressed by long time > IETF contributors like Eric Rescorla, Colin Perkins, Martin Thompson > discussion here: > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dispatch/ekMWlMXch132tvri2BwrnnULzuw/ > - The question was just about the status of those discussions as, given > the position of the people asking with respect to security, media > transport, QUIC, SRTP, at IETF, those questions will come back at one point. > - One of the question raised on the Dispatch thread was also, why at mops > and not in ART, since it looks more in scope for the later. > that's probably "for the latter". > - Another question was regarding security definition (eric/martin) > - another question, more generic, is why a new protocol when it looks like > webrtc / QUIC are a good match to the announced goal (nat traversal, TLS > 1.3, CC, BWE, ...) > => discussion on dispatch would have concluded by a request for a > document, and thus is pending this document availability. > > > > Operational Issues Observed > [15min] Jake Holland — Experience making the world safe for interdomain > multicast > Discussed some of the challenges/opportunities with interdomain multicast > Outlined goals for 2020 & eager to collaborate in trials/POCs so please > reach out if interested > Leslie Daigle: Interesting overview > > > AOB > [10min] Liaison Statement from SC 29/WG 11 to IETF MOPS WG (SC 29 N 18620) > Spencer Dawkins: Spoke to Stephan Wegner, the IAB liaison manager for SC > 29/WG 11, on Monday; he had no further updates beyond what was in the > original liaison statement they sent to IETF. > > Leslie Daigle: Git repo set up for WG > Kyle Rose: Repo will be used when documents are adopted. Not mandatory > but convenient for collaboration. Will send URL on list shortly > > > -- > Mops mailing list > Mops@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mops >
- [Mops] Draft minutes from 2020-Apr interim Kyle Rose
- Re: [Mops] Draft minutes from 2020-Apr interim Spencer Dawkins at IETF
- Re: [Mops] Draft minutes from 2020-Apr interim Leslie Daigle