Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-03
Binny Jeshan <binnyjeshan@gmail.com> Sun, 16 December 2012 14:44 UTC
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Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2012 20:14:34 +0530
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From: Binny Jeshan <binnyjeshan@gmail.com>
To: Marc Binderberger <marc@sniff.de>
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Cc: mpls@ietf.org, "Santiago Alvarez (saalvare)" <saalvare@cisco.com>, pwe3@ietf.org, rtg-bfd@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-03
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Hello, Looks like i missed this discussion. I second Sam to his point - "Good to have an informational document and do not support the idea of standardizing the intervals" And IMHO, i think BFD as it currently supports wide range of adjustable timer intervals has given good flexibility for troubleshooting faults like packet drops in high bandwidth links. Regards, Binny. Aricent Group - India. On 5 December 2012 05:19, Marc Binderberger <marc@sniff.de> wrote: > Hello Sam, Santiago, Gregory, Sharam et al., > > thanks for the feedback. Input from the MPLS and PWE3 list is welcome > regarding important timer values for which we would like to have a common > support. > > Few comments from my side: > > I can live with an informal document, at least with respect to the > "standard intervals". The document shall help to improve interoperability > and even an informal document can become de-facto standard when customers > request it ;-) > > There is the aspect of the multiple poll/final sequences to find the next > common interval. I think it is covered by RFC5880 but this statement may > require more discussion on the BFD list. If not covered then we would need > a standard, I think. > > We will not make any reference to Y.1731 in the text but where intervals > we proposed are close to Y.1731 intervals I'm fine to adjust to Y.1731 > values, which may make a combined "OAM hardware" simpler/cheaper. > > > We list the following values in the draft -03 version > > o 3.3msec: required by MPLS-TP > > o 10msec and 20msec: both values allow to detect faster than 50msec, > when used with a multiplier of 2 or 3 (for 10msec). A compromise > could be a single interval of 15msec. > > o 50msec: this seems an interval often supported by software > implementations, so the assumption here is that for convenience > this value should be supported. > > o 300msec: this would support large scale of 3 x 300msec setups used > by customers to have a detection time slightly below 1sec for VoIP > setups. > > o 1sec: as mentioned in RFC5880 > > > We also discussed some time ago that the 300msec could be replaced by > 100msec intervals but this still needs more discussion. And the lower > interval range 10-50msec, especially 10-20msec, I personally tend to have > more "standard values" than less, providing more common intervals between > hardware based BFD and software based BFD; it is at least my impression > that in this range most software-based implementations have their lower > limit and the more common intervals the easier we can support 50-60msec > detect+restore even with software-based BFD (10msec may just push the > limit, 100msec is obviously too slow). > > > This is vague beside the 3.3msec and 1sec, so again if good reasons exist > for specific values from the MPLS, MPLS-TP and PWE3 standards or > applications: input is very welcome! > > > Thanks & Regards, > Marc > > > > > On 2012-12-03, at 20:53 , Sam Aldrin wrote: > > I echo what Santiago had said in his email. Good to have an informational > document and do not support the idea of standardizing the intervals. > > -sam > On Dec 3, 2012, at 11:48 AM, "Santiago Alvarez (saalvare)" < > saalvare@cisco.com> wrote: > > Applicability of BFD is pretty wide. Mandating a set of intervals driven > by Y.1731 doesn’t sound like a good idea to me. Having lived through most > of the BFD CC interop testing in the context of MPLS-TP, I can see some > value in having an informational doc that would discuss interval > configuration and interoperability.**** > Cheers.**** > > SA**** > --**** > > *From:* mpls-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:mpls-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of > *Gregory Mirsky > *Sent:* Monday, December 03, 2012 11:33 AM > *To:* Marc Binderberger; Shahram Davari > *Cc:* mpls@ietf.org; rtg-bfd@ietf.org; pwe3@ietf.org > *Subject:* Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-03**** > ** ** > Dear Shahram, Marc, et al.,**** > I think that since BFD is the CC/CV part of MPLS-TP OAM both MPLS and PWE3 > WGs have a stake in this discussion.**** > I agree that compatibility with intervals standardized for Ether OAM > (CFM/Y.1731) makes sense and might be helpful in interworking. But I'll > note that even with the same transmission intervals failure detection in > BFD-based CC/CV and Ether OAM is different time interval. Not by much but > different nevertheless.**** > And I agree with Marc that BFD-based CC is not only for packet or Ethernet > transport applications. And more values of transmission interval are > useful. That is why I believe that we should not standardize any values, at > least not on Standard Track. At most it could be an informational document. > Or, which will be great, have a survey among providers on what interval > values being used (similar to great survey on PWE VCCV Control Channels).* > *** > **** > Regards,**** > Greg**** > ** ** > ------------------------------ > > *From:* rtg-bfd-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:rtg-bfd-bounces@ietf.org<rtg-bfd-bounces@ietf.org> > ] *On Behalf Of *Marc Binderberger > *Sent:* Monday, December 03, 2012 11:08 AM > *To:* Shahram Davari > *Cc:* rtg-bfd@ietf.org > *Subject:* Re: Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-03**** > Hello Shahram,**** > ** ** > thanks for re-vitalizing this discussion - must admit I was busy with too > many other things.**** > ** ** > I do agree with including the values you mention in the list of BFD > supported values, although I question the large values.**** > ** ** > On the other hand: we are not re-inventing Ethernet OAM and we _have_ BFD > implementations out there. So we likely need to support other values as > well to fit into the existing world.**** > ** ** > ** ** > Regards, Marc**** > ** ** > ** ** > ** ** > ** ** > ** ** > On 2012-12-03, at 20:02 , Shahram Davari wrote:**** > > > **** > Hi,**** > I would like to propose standardizing the same intervals as Y.1731/802.1ag > for BFD. This would make the total L2, L3 OAM more homogeneous. So the > proposal is:**** > 3.3ms, 10ms, 100ms, 1 sec, 10sec, 1 min, 10min.**** > Thank you,**** > Shharam**** > ** ** > --**** > Marc Binderberger <marc@sniff.de>**** > ** ** > _______________________________________________ > mpls mailing list > mpls@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls > > > > -- > Marc Binderberger <marc@sniff.de> > >
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Gregory Mirsky
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Santiago Alvarez (saalvare)
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Sam Aldrin
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Marc Binderberger
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Binny Jeshan
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Binny Jeshan
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Nobo Akiya (nobo)
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Marc Binderberger
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Nobo Akiya (nobo)
- Re: [mpls] Commenst on draft-akiya-bfd-intervals-… Jeffrey Haas