Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MPTCP proxy work
Jordan Melzer <Jordan.Melzer@telus.com> Wed, 19 April 2017 18:59 UTC
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From: Jordan Melzer <Jordan.Melzer@telus.com>
To: Joe Touch <touch@isi.edu>, "mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>, "philip.eardley@bt.com" <philip.eardley@bt.com>, "multipathtcp@ietf.org" <multipathtcp@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MPTCP proxy work
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Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2017 18:59:18 +0000
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Subject: Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MPTCP proxy work
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It's a conventional proxy. There are different sockets on each side of the proxy, different RTTs, different congestion control. The proposal is to find a near-zero overhead way to do this when the proxy is off-path (ie, when it's not a simple connection hijack). This may be totally possible without a new RFC - Christoph Paasch suggested that SOCKS + TFO could basically become this, but I am not sure anyone who cared either caught it or agreed. Re b), it's off-topic, but what would you think of a multipath tunnel that was basically MPTCP with the retransmissions gutted out? I had thought this would be what BANANA is doing, but I am not clear there are any two people in BANANA who agree on what it is. From: multipathtcp [mailto:multipathtcp-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Joe Touch Sent: April 19, 2017 02:17 PM To: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com; philip.eardley@bt.com; multipathtcp@ietf.org Subject: Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MPTCP proxy work On 4/18/2017 10:26 PM, mohamed.boucadair@orange.com wrote: As explained in my previous message, there is no layered congestion control. All packets are transported over plain TCP: no encap, no tunnel. I did say "if"; I now understand better what you're trying to do, but there are plenty of parts still not addressed: I really reiterate my comment to read https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/98/slides/slides-98-mptcp-sessa-network-ass isted-mptcp-03.pdf Here's what those slides do not explain: - is this system 1:1 per client TCP connection, or are you expecting a single MPTCP between proxies to support multiples? - what is the congestion control interaction? I.e., does the client think the RTT is to the proxy (which will work), or to the TCP receiver past the end of the MPTCP connection? NOTE: if the latter, then you still end up with layered congestion control - what is the proxy relaying? is it TCP data, or is it somehow trying to tunnel and reconstitute the entire packet? NOTE: if it reconstitutes the packet, what happens when you get an option you don't understand? E.g., EDO? There are still plenty of more concerns with this system. Overall, you *still* appear to be doing one of two things: a) acting like a conventional application-layer proxy, which would be fine but would not require any new RFCs b) tunneling - or acting exactly like you're tunneling, by reconstituting packets on the other end - a TCP connection over TCP, which is a bad idea So which is it? Or is it something else? Joe
- [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MPTCP … philip.eardley
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… christian.jacquenet
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Juliusz Chroboczek
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Stefano Secci
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Sargent, Matthew T. (GRC-LCA0)[Peerless Technologies]
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Henderickx, Wim (Nokia - BE/Antwerp)
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Henderickx, Wim (Nokia - BE/Antwerp)
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Yoshifumi Nishida
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… David Allan I
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Juliusz Chroboczek
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Yoshifumi Nishida
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Olivier Bonaventure
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Costin Raiciu
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Olivier Bonaventure
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… philip.eardley
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Markus.Brunner3
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Robert Skog
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Sargent, Matthew T. (GRC-LCA0)[Peerless Technologies]
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Jordan Melzer
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Juliusz Chroboczek
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Juliusz Chroboczek
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Sargent, Matthew T. (GRC-LCA0)[Peerless Technologies]
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Juliusz Chroboczek
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Eggert, Lars
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Eggert, Lars
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Yoshifumi Nishida
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Juliusz Chroboczek
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… philip.eardley
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Sébastien Barré
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Wouter Cloetens
- [multipathtcp] Increasing usage of MPTCP [was: Co… Juliusz Chroboczek
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… SungHoon Seo
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Increasing usage of MPTCP [was… Olivier Bonaventure
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Matt Sargent
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Increasing usage of MPTCP [was… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Meyer, Ullrich, Vodafone DE
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Juliusz Chroboczek
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Juliusz Chroboczek
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Joe Touch
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… Yoshifumi Nishida
- Re: [multipathtcp] Consensus call on potential MP… mohamed.boucadair