Re: [netmod] YANG Versioning Weekly Call Minutes - 2022-05-24

Jürgen Schönwälder <j.schoenwaelder@jacobs-university.de> Tue, 24 May 2022 15:30 UTC

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Date: Tue, 24 May 2022 17:30:27 +0200
From: Jürgen Schönwälder <j.schoenwaelder@jacobs-university.de>
To: "Sterne, Jason (Nokia - CA/Ottawa)" <jason.sterne@nokia.com>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/netmod/7Pt3uo_tyDBLV9LOz5HBVoF6Tk4>
Subject: Re: [netmod] YANG Versioning Weekly Call Minutes - 2022-05-24
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For me, this all looks absolutely backwards. Humans make changes and
it can be expected that humans document changes that violate the YANG
backwards compatibility rules. Hence, I prefer:

   Any change that is not backwards compatible acording to the YANG
   update rules MUST be tagged.

This is a simple and well defined rule. The rules that were proposed
are instead defined using some hypothetical machine and vague terms
such as easy, realistic, complex or unrealistic. Such terms escape my
understanding of sound engineering since they all are subjective and
not well defined.

Furthermore, either there is a defined algorithm (machine) or there is
none. And furthermore, assuming that everyone has access to an
implementation of such an algorithm is another interesting idea.

Why is it too much to ask people breaking backwards compatibility to
properly document where they do so?

/js

On Tue, May 24, 2022 at 02:09:10PM +0000, Sterne, Jason (Nokia - CA/Ottawa) wrote:
> YANG Versioning Weekly Call Minutes - 2022-05-24
> 
> As part of "per-element" BC/NBC tags, we need to define default assumptions that a tool will make for certain types of module changes. Note that these are just assumptions, not definitive rules that these changes are indeed NBC or BC. In some cases, there will be a default assumption below, but an author is obligated to document whether a change is BC or NBC (e.g. for a "must" statement the tool will assume NBC, but the author will decide if it is really BC or NBC, and potentially tag that element, based on whether the constraint is relaxes or not, as per RFC 7950).
> 
> A) descriptive strings (e.g. description, org, presence argument string, revision, units): editorial (for add/remove/change)
> 
> B) changes that a machine should be able to compare and easily determine BC vs NBC (e.g. YANG version, range, import, adding a "must", etc):  as per rules in draft
> 
> C) changes that are complex/unrealistic for a machine to figure out (e.g. changes to patterns, must statements, when statements, and leafref paths): NBC
> 
> D) extensions: if it is a known extension to the tool then use the defined rules for that extensino. If unknown, then assume BC but flag "unknown extension additions / removals / changes".  Note:
>       - some models are sprinkled with BC extensions
>                   - some models are sprinkled with NBC extensions
> 
> Balazs: New github issue: codify how extension additions/removals/changes are BC vs NBC in a machine readable way
> [ maybe in tool comparison draft ?]
> 
> Jason: New github issue: did we forget to say that import changes are BC in module versioning ?  (adding, removing, changing the import by revision, etc).  Add to section 3.1.1.
> 
> We're now done going through the feedback on WGLC from Jurgen, Italo and Andy. Responses are in progress by Reshad, Rob and Joe.
> 
> Next meeting: talk about Comparison Draft and Packages
> 
> ----------------------------------------------
> Versioning work on Github:
> https://github.com/netmod-wg/yang-ver-dt
> 
> ----------------------------------------------
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> 
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> 
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-- 
Jürgen Schönwälder              Jacobs University Bremen gGmbH
Phone: +49 421 200 3587         Campus Ring 1 | 28759 Bremen | Germany
Fax:   +49 421 200 3103         <https://www.jacobs-university.de/>