IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [netmod] YANG next

"Rob Wilton (rwilton)" <rwilton@cisco.com> Thu, 25 July 2019 12:56 UTC

Return-Path: <rwilton@cisco.com>
X-Original-To: netmod@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: netmod@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF92F12015F for <netmod@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 25 Jul 2019 05:56:26 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -14.499
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.499 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com header.b=G6NnzXZU; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.onmicrosoft.com header.b=qAjaFtdj
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DRA_fWbqpHD0 for <netmod@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 25 Jul 2019 05:56:24 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from rcdn-iport-9.cisco.com (rcdn-iport-9.cisco.com [173.37.86.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9EB1712002E for <netmod@ietf.org>; Thu, 25 Jul 2019 05:56:24 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=13252; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1564059384; x=1565268984; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:references: in-reply-to:mime-version; bh=jDbtJat0/+xMo5QeccukcKI0NoeYwzsw3zKh9Kut35I=; b=G6NnzXZUe/gZ30JmkdNzqMipXbCE4pGOeG3/BoGQtg0uPTZBZ7AZHwFK bWakN00zUrJanGQ4hUkw7fqb3gNB/+Bq5LhJk/QmOnY6pGHijCBMLLDSD pp0LPJrke2S0YLb9SkZBGtebtGV6D71D/BEJGidyt9fHj9FrxAQjohN4c 0=;
IronPort-PHdr: 9a23:xC307hXsc1ZUZq6JK81LoiGNtzrV8LGuZFwc94YnhrRSc6+q45XlOgnF6O5wiEPSA92J8OpK3uzRta2oGXcN55qMqjgjSNRNTFdE7KdehAk8GIiAAEz/IuTtankgA8VGSFhj13q6KkNSXs35Yg6arw==
X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true
X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: A0AIAACzpTld/49dJa1mGgEBAQEBAgEBAQEHAgEBAQGBUwUBAQEBCwGBFC9QA21VIAQLKoQdg0cDhFKILIJbfpF9hFeBLoEkA1QJAQEBDAEBIwoCAQGDCYE3AheCRSM0CQ4BAwEBBAEBAgEGbYUeDIVKAQEBAQMSEQoTAQE3AQ8CAQgRBAEBKAMCAgIwFAkIAgQBDQUIGoMBgR1NAx0BAgyiSAKBOIhgcYEygnoBAQWFChiCEwMGgTQBi18XgUA/gRFGghc1PoJhAoFjKwmCVTKCJo59hH+WeQkCghqGWY1Sgi2LMYoujTqHSpALAgQCBAUCDgEBBYFQOIFYcBWDJ4JCDBeDTopTcoEpjTIBAQ
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.64,306,1559520000"; d="scan'208,217";a="517354116"
Received: from rcdn-core-7.cisco.com ([173.37.93.143]) by rcdn-iport-9.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA; 25 Jul 2019 12:56:23 +0000
Received: from XCH-RCD-005.cisco.com (xch-rcd-005.cisco.com [173.37.102.15]) by rcdn-core-7.cisco.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x6PCuNpH021350 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Thu, 25 Jul 2019 12:56:23 GMT
Received: from xhs-rtp-002.cisco.com (64.101.210.229) by XCH-RCD-005.cisco.com (173.37.102.15) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1473.3; Thu, 25 Jul 2019 07:56:22 -0500
Received: from xhs-rtp-003.cisco.com (64.101.210.230) by xhs-rtp-002.cisco.com (64.101.210.229) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1473.3; Thu, 25 Jul 2019 08:56:21 -0400
Received: from NAM01-BN3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (64.101.32.56) by xhs-rtp-003.cisco.com (64.101.210.230) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1473.3 via Frontend Transport; Thu, 25 Jul 2019 08:56:21 -0400
ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=gmYjKz1xbPMvVizsUWNI6eXyPzwegapRmD0hiG/qZhx2JKE4ihad9TfP3sqnNbE7weNJswSJ3020VKi3uhvkid59lGbF5+8RSQAsktqYgv7gwom9ekXFWqralcNwwUFfAbKSmkTzqF3/amIwqiZltJdt7hDd5U3J80Yp3ep344SrQ48O4QuqPfwUp/lropSrDeabNzNgoJvBM7HrtyN/6tWL+CGn46pfgZiGkhUMgiljUMkA+VVDmpL0jg6MWi809wZjQIuwtFiBzkoQlO4SAeb2CX3omRC79zTivyKE+h++khmHbdhbdmQIGueM4kha7Zb2OSNreswzE8gc22LcZQ==
ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=jDbtJat0/+xMo5QeccukcKI0NoeYwzsw3zKh9Kut35I=; b=JbB704/rZWOceT5HbSaDR7ibdaKKeSVZYjKdLrbNjfs72hvPYaKSCXbYNfG9M5qiFBKthuIsr5uijCTLl30mDvh6x5OGgHCVzGwzqBQp3/IDkxbXhD+z0zqNyv79j+Bna7fshwblDyMGu/FWStc/qnhk2IO0R7/R9K6zDZ2JVuyoN2QBLqHm8chSCOe3VvdyIP70RC6ovebAKZaR6Rf78Z1fLhXPVscbjRpU+oGinf25ni/3GZuzLMFUeIwOqkijOU4uo+1yMmiZe4VIyf23u1040xhRinT3IjQ90kINkXwXq9ClYa2PdFiEuAxkx07v8nxLQpU4ly2eJd4HuXEiRw==
ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1;spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=cisco.com;dmarc=pass action=none header.from=cisco.com;dkim=pass header.d=cisco.com;arc=none
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cisco.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector2-cisco-onmicrosoft-com; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=jDbtJat0/+xMo5QeccukcKI0NoeYwzsw3zKh9Kut35I=; b=qAjaFtdj5LOqcfGy4JLxIBsGa89MqVIrJUNKyn10fGz1p63l921eqoh6z4fzPzXJIw2+l/8byfwGJcnB24jEATvRuK/SYXbeKgZFfmsr7OHKzaaiiYprOVgl1JZcFqk0MqN+Tv3Qzd524tR7BYh7XLAE3Sc69F4xc5Y47igPXb4=
Received: from BYAPR11MB2631.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (52.135.227.28) by BYAPR11MB3174.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (20.177.127.27) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.2115.10; Thu, 25 Jul 2019 12:56:20 +0000
Received: from BYAPR11MB2631.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::91da:1669:aaf0:d428]) by BYAPR11MB2631.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::91da:1669:aaf0:d428%4]) with mapi id 15.20.2115.005; Thu, 25 Jul 2019 12:56:20 +0000
From: "Rob Wilton (rwilton)" <rwilton@cisco.com>
To: Andy Bierman <andy@yumaworks.com>, Kent Watsen <kent@watsen.net>
CC: "netmod@ietf.org" <netmod@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [netmod] YANG next
Thread-Index: AQHVQXBQtjURL141VkWQZDrJ7b+rTKbYYs2AgAAbWICAAAnKgIAANJOAgAEaPYCAADDkgIAAEcIAgAEy3/A=
Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2019 12:56:20 +0000
Message-ID: <BYAPR11MB26313098C4AABAF268329BDCB5C10@BYAPR11MB2631.namprd11.prod.outlook.com>
References: <ff5d90b51872df190abb226cb10d51a635e88521.camel@nic.cz> <CABCOCHRxfKWh1OS3bUJAabk3XAqTCiOswiE65JtMC8eyxMUxMA@mail.gmail.com> <02c4110737b4ff23f966e6153fad764f04436089.camel@nic.cz> <CABCOCHQoKAiugVsDhuHSvhfnCbP2D2caLU88cF-AkkH0aCSOUA@mail.gmail.com> <c35ae918e65411575b7e18dfd24547cbbf9d216d.camel@nic.cz> <856cce29-f524-be31-b5e5-bcb679721e9a@hq.sk> <0100016c25074dba-bffd4eea-f851-4913-83da-df3da8774f76-000000@email.amazonses.com> <CABCOCHR5MJLuRVtZBa_VbBXX4nrRJMUQBpU13P8a1oRE1_6C2g@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CABCOCHR5MJLuRVtZBa_VbBXX4nrRJMUQBpU13P8a1oRE1_6C2g@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=rwilton@cisco.com;
x-originating-ip: [2001:420:c0c8:1008::51]
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: caa2b6d9-81a3-4cd6-7a33-08d710ff7db9
x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(8989299)(4534185)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(8990200)(5600148)(711020)(4605104)(1401327)(2017052603328)(7193020); SRVR:BYAPR11MB3174;
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: BYAPR11MB3174:
x-ms-exchange-purlcount: 3
x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: <BYAPR11MB31744253750FCEFDC72A5A24B5C10@BYAPR11MB3174.namprd11.prod.outlook.com>
x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:8882;
x-forefront-prvs: 0109D382B0
x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10009020)(4636009)(376002)(396003)(366004)(346002)(136003)(39860400002)(189003)(199004)(51444003)(486006)(606006)(186003)(46003)(6116002)(11346002)(478600001)(8676002)(790700001)(446003)(476003)(316002)(81156014)(256004)(110136005)(81166006)(5660300002)(71200400001)(7736002)(68736007)(236005)(2906002)(54896002)(229853002)(7696005)(25786009)(71190400001)(66946007)(64756008)(66446008)(99286004)(74316002)(66556008)(66476007)(966005)(9686003)(86362001)(6306002)(14454004)(55016002)(6246003)(33656002)(53546011)(102836004)(6506007)(4326008)(76176011)(76116006)(6436002)(8936002)(53936002)(52536014); DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; SCL:1; SRVR:BYAPR11MB3174; H:BYAPR11MB2631.namprd11.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1;
received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: cisco.com does not designate permitted sender hosts)
x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: O4xpaZUpD8iGpy+zHo6AYoO1j8RFughTYrgjIxHMK/++O16ftwAZNtPj5/0eoTRiS8piHswTYLJr/sQNoiNBDu/qb5bpDVnhpxb7zUcd/fMwv/EgN0klOs+CyYILmmdql8H2mNXyMeV0Xb942X+1jXlXR+B44MbhzGQgPfiRL3IOJ1irgcqQYRF/Ma0MQNHGb/B7UaARjYNyqQ2UI3+EJU62ambFEf8W10RtBUbDc3YZmvEsJ/msDadbI8Z7b5HbqR4vKA4tqOLHfAqHIclKDNz3OzDnVF+bFtB4NhGPLQZ/KpG0sz0NoPer5Ds5kmM8TnAqAEBJOSmIH4LA28ZS/QZfk2tWXu2kFnLaarDqpqeKzh1kgfX/lFLXPK4xEn9H/T0mQw+LPsScDGQW+RlCi6IsH7arBk2yMw6Hzlgbgog=
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_BYAPR11MB26313098C4AABAF268329BDCB5C10BYAPR11MB2631namp_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: caa2b6d9-81a3-4cd6-7a33-08d710ff7db9
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 25 Jul 2019 12:56:20.6587 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 5ae1af62-9505-4097-a69a-c1553ef7840e
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: rwilton@cisco.com
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BYAPR11MB3174
X-OriginatorOrg: cisco.com
X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 173.37.102.15, xch-rcd-005.cisco.com
X-Outbound-Node: rcdn-core-7.cisco.com
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/netmod/DBCWEg1xQaxivDcz8bc12czYrM0>
Subject: Re: [netmod] YANG next
X-BeenThere: netmod@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: NETMOD WG list <netmod.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/netmod>, <mailto:netmod-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/netmod/>
List-Post: <mailto:netmod@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:netmod-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod>, <mailto:netmod-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2019 12:56:27 -0000

I also think that there is significant value to splitting the NETCONF and XML specification out of RFC 7950 (but keeping XML examples).  I think that this may be beneficial to YANG’s longevity, and I’m sure that it would make it easier to maintain and extend the NETCONF/RESTCONF/YANG document set in future.

Thanks,
Rob


From: netmod <netmod-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Andy Bierman
Sent: 24 July 2019 14:32
To: Kent Watsen <kent@watsen.net>
Cc: netmod@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [netmod] YANG next



On Wed, Jul 24, 2019 at 10:28 AM Kent Watsen <kent@watsen.net<mailto:kent@watsen.net>> wrote:

So you want to work on YANG 1.2, but just the parts you want to change? ;-)
I am actually fine with not doing any changes to YANG 1.1 at all, except perhaps
bug fixes. This doesn't necessarily mean closing the NETMOD WG, it would IMO be
immensely useful to rewrite the language specification and remove NETCONF- and
XML-specific part.

+1. There are plenty of ambiguities and NETCONF/XML pollution in the
spec. Having the specifications in a DAG would be immensely useful :)

Agreed and I should've mentioned before that Martin said in Prague that he'd already started this effort, seeing it as a necessary pre-step before making other changes.  I'm unsure if the intention is to release this by itself as an RFC 7950 bis but, if looking for a minimal change, that might be it.  The next rung up would be to just add clarifications.  The next rung up from there would be to add only backwards-compatible changes (currently targeted by [1]).  The last rung being to also target NBC changes (there's no consensus to do this).


This WG sure likes to spend time refactoring documents.
Moving lots of text will create bugs and strong coupling, and only help the standards purists.
It will be a lot of work for the WG and IESG to review such a massive document split,
and in the end we have no improvement in YANG, just more RFCs to read.

Andy

[1] https://github.com/netmod-wg/yang-next/projects/2<https://github..com/netmod-wg/yang-next/projects/2>

Kent

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email