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Re: [Ntp] The NTP WG has placed draft-roughtime-aanchal in state "Call For Adoption By WG Issued"

Watson Ladd <watsonbladd@gmail.com> Tue, 10 September 2019 13:56 UTC

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References: <watsonbladd@gmail.com> <CACsn0cktCkUjS-gUSWPhVoo+LWJD_MVeSaX2WqdcH0WNPyo2Tg@mail.gmail.com> <20190910063355.7082A40605C@ip-64-139-1-69.sjc.megapath.net>
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From: Watson Ladd <watsonbladd@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2019 06:55:55 -0700
Message-ID: <CACsn0cmb6tANKy=+HRHnKfYzgB7YwdBdLVvb6M-Z9BosKriszQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Hal Murray <hmurray@megapathdsl.net>
Cc: NTP WG <ntp@ietf.org>, Harlan Stenn <stenn@nwtime.org>
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Subject: Re: [Ntp] The NTP WG has placed draft-roughtime-aanchal in state "Call For Adoption By WG Issued"
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On Mon, Sep 9, 2019, 11:34 PM Hal Murray <hmurray@megapathdsl.net> wrote:

>
> watsonbladd@gmail.com said:
> > I  would welcome specific suggestions for improvement or things you find
> > unclear.
>
> I'm missing the big picture.  Why is this interesting?  Is this for some
> legal
> requirements?
>

Because people cheat at Candy Crush Saga. To do this they change their
phone clocks and this is the leading cause of certificate validation
errors. With things like delegated credentials this becomes a bigger
problem.


> Why invent a new packet format rather than use an extension on NTP packets?
>
> Why is it interesting to have a convincing proof that server X returned
> the
> wrong time?  I see 3 cases:
>   1) some new bug has been triggered, for example a GPS week number roll
> over.
>  (WNRO)
>   2) the operator is sloppy or incompetent or ??? and has broken something
>   3) the operator is a bad guy.
>
> In case 1, the operator will fix the problem if we point it out.  A quick
> test
> is enough.  No proof needed.
>
> In case 2, maybe they learn something, maybe they don't.  A proof won't
> help.
>
> In case 3, the bad guy will give the truth to roughtime but lie on NTP.
> So we
> don't have a proof when it might be helpful.  (That assumes we are using
> NTP
> to get accurate time.)
>

Some applications like PKI do not require extreme precision but do require
accuracy. We can of course not trust operators that return the wrong time.


>
>
> --
> These are my opinions.  I hate spam.
>
>
>
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