[Ntp] Minute from the last interim 2019-05-29
"Dieter Sibold" <dsibold.ietf@gmail.com> Tue, 16 July 2019 20:55 UTC
Return-Path: <dsibold.ietf@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ntp@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ntp@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA5231200F9 for <ntp@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 13:55:41 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.999
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cLoTeYVAJYug for <ntp@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 13:55:39 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-wm1-x32f.google.com (mail-wm1-x32f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::32f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5CD4D1200C1 for <ntp@ietf.org>; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 13:55:39 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-wm1-x32f.google.com with SMTP id a15so19984189wmj.5 for <ntp@ietf.org>; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 13:55:39 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version; bh=yiHnTrd/KvE1OZnnWX9n9WTdXheRo1y+5oTixVLScqs=; b=svddKp2ahjvQcA3kzZpoWAKfR6oiAWkFDKq8486n93lvFhzVhFm7DcVyml1UtgF4Y7 EGLDWSnEVJJyQeeN8ZJFa6vvkE+nlX/Tmf+fWniuMMnJt2ElYriANMfhFyessALgMXAQ m/N5ZawKbb270ib6fuCM35I4BLIk6gd7twH0wnbzP0xaqWxynmMcOKoP1434QW8UIbKd p2rqf2VxRyxEXbG0Mwx8Y+CM+FhX3II3QghM0u+Gh8pR+giq9u/z8RC3ajtKIxyIvOo4 XSJGnHTkDmjniRjPHN7MEpQqKHyFAeTvKHN7erQeolAfUmQz4cwDHny2cL0kiQ9y64V/ yMqw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version; bh=yiHnTrd/KvE1OZnnWX9n9WTdXheRo1y+5oTixVLScqs=; b=rMwt7nKClfzCrjBkWfLlSV6wd8yW1EbC9ZwuBq4bJgD27//FGkdEfdDCEahIPtQEYE qB5fgy3MJgI3koa3bbi2cI7eXBQZEQDwkDIZIeqOzcVnxBGJVvNozmD0nH6M8TjyRNwo SH5SBKQ5eqwbnAtSy0DtzHbVQB/Lg1+A13J13htx0FEInQDXox/LAYnUQoVLKbiCuiUH PFTzh1XYwf05Kl8yz81yXYNO6i5ZiPUVNxiPs/Z3uGeBSRHvN0oTJae8ufFFvA6py8O5 yTvusQ9wI6P3xt3p3lWsS/RX/hKF2U9Z0cHmHYWPFouE+jLyRhXs0pzpT1gVjM9mYkZl 22Wg==
X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUIHILvswGe2DdNWuPy0jdBAVHEBoScByakQGuSpt6R8DViYxgD sCvJwxgNT6G2k/Qcnguu8vM782Yo
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyQ90tLI6uNmQwIJkNFkDjavM8WMdBE7huHmHdsG1UfuTpYGPdAQjSEw/Y+4wDJZ7m2scukjQ==
X-Received: by 2002:a1c:5f87:: with SMTP id t129mr33978928wmb.150.1563310537471; Tue, 16 Jul 2019 13:55:37 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.111.27] (p200300D17F30B100597BAB0E91BE1067.dip0.t-ipconnect.de. [2003:d1:7f30:b100:597b:ab0e:91be:1067]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 18sm21300745wmg.43.2019.07.16.13.55.36 for <ntp@ietf.org> (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 16 Jul 2019 13:55:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: Dieter Sibold <dsibold.ietf@gmail.com>
To: NTP WG <ntp@ietf.org>
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 22:55:35 +0200
X-Mailer: MailMate (1.12.5r5635)
Message-ID: <219E9253-FCFF-48F1-B28E-AF833AFA1336@gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format="flowed"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ntp/r_PwBX_PEHCbXaFobYP1I0IXKEA>
Subject: [Ntp] Minute from the last interim 2019-05-29
X-BeenThere: ntp@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: <ntp.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ntp>, <mailto:ntp-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ntp/>
List-Post: <mailto:ntp@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ntp-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ntp>, <mailto:ntp-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2019 20:55:42 -0000
Dear all, I'm deeply sorry for the delay of the minutes from the last interim. Please apologize. My minute taking during the last interim was somewhat incomplete because of technical issues. Please check the minutes below and send me correction or addition until Thursday evening. After that I will upload the minute to the data tracker. Thanks Greetings Dieter NTP WG INTERIM MEETING, 2019-05-29 ================================== Participants ------------ Karen O'Donoghue, Dieter Sibold, Thomas Peterson, Tal Mizrahi, Danny Mayer, Denis Reilly, Harlan Stenn, Miroslav Lichvar, Kristof Teichel, F. Gont, Watson Ladd 1. Administrative and Agenda Bashing - No agenda bashing - No objection to record the meeting - Tal: Slides are not online yet 2. TICTOC quick document status - YANG data model is published as RFC 8575 - IEEE 1588 Enterprise Profile is submitted to the IESG. - After publication of the Enterprise Profile the TICTOC WG will be closed 3. NTP quick document status - BCP is in Editor Queue - MAC draft is in Auth 48 - Shepard writeup for the drafts NTS for NTP und Guidelines for Defining Packet Timestamps are in preparation - Draft YANG Data Model for NTP in Yang Doctor review 4. Discussion on documents (working group and individual) that have been updated - Interleave Mode - Miroslav: updated a new version. Changes in request of the last meeting. Two paragraphs have been changes. Ready to be advanced. No questions. - Summary: this draft is going to the IESG - Roughtime - nobody of the authors are online - Correction field and Short Extension field - Miroslav: No changes to both documents - Summary (Karen): will leave it on the list and looking for the progress of the various extension field draft - Port Randomization Discussion: - F Gont: The usage of port 123 of NTP traffic is not necessary. Various research has found that the usage of predictable port number is problematic and should be avoided. - F Gont: This I-D will make NTP compliant to BCP 156. - Danny: Presumably this draft improves security. It does not improve security - F Gont: An attacker has to guess what port is in use. Randomization will make this more difficult - Danny: does not accept the arguments - Karen: any other comments - Gont: this is the same discussion as with other protocols years ago - Gont: the problem applies to to all transport protocols - Karen further comments? - Miroslav: this is useful and should be adopted - Karen: any other question - Kristof: should be adopted to be discussed - F Gont: most NTP implementation already randomize the port number. - Danny: Problem with a NTP instance that is a client and a server. What do you gain? - Harlan: the client can already use other port number - F Gont: It is not good practice to leave this decision to the implementation - Danny: there are not only four variable that identify an association but five - F Gont: This is ture of the application layer. I speak about the transport layer. This draft improves security on the transport layer - Watson: we had issues because of the fixed port number 123. DDoS attacks - Karen (without the chair's hat): we need to have better reasoning for adopting this draft. - F Gont: this draft follows the work of the transport area and which is formulated as a BCP. The Transport area should be involved. - Karen: the argument that there is a BCP is very compelling. We should seriously consider to adopt it. - Danny: just because there is a BCP it does not apply to any protocol. - Karen: That true, but we need to consider the BCP and have to formulate that it does not apply to NTP. - F Gont: you need to make a good argument that the BCP does not apply for NTP - Summary (Karen): we need to consider the BCP and have to decide later if we adopt this draft. - Roughtime - Watson: Usage of MJD for leap second issues, some other changes, ... - Karen: further question? - Discussion about the need to consider delay attacks and bounded RTT in the draft (Tal, Watson, Kristof) - Summary (Karen): Please, think about this and discuss it on the mailing list 5. AOB (Any Other Business?) Dieter Sibold dsibold.ietf@gmail.com
- [Ntp] Minute from the last interim 2019-05-29 Dieter Sibold