Re: [OAUTH-WG] Stephen Farrell's Discuss on draft-ietf-oauth-json-web-token-27: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)

John Bradley <ve7jtb@ve7jtb.com> Mon, 06 October 2014 22:48 UTC

Return-Path: <ve7jtb@ve7jtb.com>
X-Original-To: oauth@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: oauth@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DB291A889E for <oauth@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 6 Oct 2014 15:48:15 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.831
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.831 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_SORBS_WEB=0.77, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SQLeYCiJ-3HH for <oauth@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 6 Oct 2014 15:48:13 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-qa0-f51.google.com (mail-qa0-f51.google.com [209.85.216.51]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 93A561A6F84 for <oauth@ietf.org>; Mon, 6 Oct 2014 15:48:13 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-qa0-f51.google.com with SMTP id k15so4199546qaq.10 for <oauth@ietf.org>; Mon, 06 Oct 2014 15:48:12 -0700 (PDT)
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:content-type:mime-version:subject:from :in-reply-to:date:cc:content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references :to; bh=LVlWbdxjlKNROgSPW6M15Sra9DWu6wBCMdYHWmgxdVA=; b=gQJxlHatjqD8pG2Gjy+gPynS3ahnvIUndEC3cDt8NoMFQFsBZ4jrnHUwYWe3R99KhD E4NCGB8LrlfMXVPvqtT5GKZznq0TO7hTSG8BryHYLSs8gph4tpuzWi4QOusnxoORGTU0 z7HF87xW3fTTGKeXc8cl9jdKFs7dC4SxsFKs1LCbDDjNJ4Aux9clTfcqeXnQd8KcvvsV H9uhxSK+nrMh6seyT4p5lRdlVX7XSlAX0hCStvQCNfM0wXjUYCyeRG05TVnZiEntQBhh IsyWA9iBU9+KtJDxBXWpXJ8ynd9jN9CUYUV32QuBDxsI5X9wvb23KdELiN9KGJNzRBz2 rvXA==
X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnvokB466aiFTxE/7i77S556FyIXikSYB+hmFQpblH4qy6wI3RFz0Sur3IESjj9rC3rU0/d
X-Received: by 10.140.85.17 with SMTP id m17mr31780407qgd.50.1412635692650; Mon, 06 Oct 2014 15:48:12 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.8.100] ([186.65.202.239]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id s49sm13666178qge.15.2014.10.06.15.48.10 for <multiple recipients> (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 06 Oct 2014 15:48:12 -0700 (PDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.3 \(1878.6\))
From: John Bradley <ve7jtb@ve7jtb.com>
In-Reply-To: <54330CD5.8090807@cs.tcd.ie>
Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2014 19:48:09 -0300
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <92001C85-19DC-4F09-9AD7-74307B0CDE9D@ve7jtb.com>
References: <20141002120308.9386.79961.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <4E1F6AAD24975D4BA5B16804296739439BAF0C2A@TK5EX14MBXC286.redmond.corp.microsoft.com> <54330CD5.8090807@cs.tcd.ie>
To: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1878.6)
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/oauth/N939q8i9Y0wrtBZsdK_eweGDw7A
Cc: "oauth-chairs@tools.ietf.org" <oauth-chairs@tools.ietf.org>, "oauth@ietf.org" <oauth@ietf.org>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-oauth-json-web-token@tools.ietf.org" <draft-ietf-oauth-json-web-token@tools.ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [OAUTH-WG] Stephen Farrell's Discuss on draft-ietf-oauth-json-web-token-27: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
X-BeenThere: oauth@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: OAUTH WG <oauth.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/oauth>, <mailto:oauth-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/oauth/>
List-Post: <mailto:oauth@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:oauth-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/oauth>, <mailto:oauth-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2014 22:48:15 -0000

While my personal preference is to not release PII as part of authentication, We do have people demanding attributes in SAML and Connect at LoA 2+ for identity resolution at the relying party.
https://www.idmanagement.gov/sites/default/files/documents/FICAM_TFS_ATOS.pdf  (see Appendix A)

JWT is used in much more than just OAuth these days.

John B.



On Oct 6, 2014, at 6:42 PM, Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie> wrote:

>> 
>> but sometimes the very
>> point of a JWT is to securely deliver PII from a verifiable party to
>> an intended party with appropriate rights to receive it.
> 
> Hmm. Its a moot point (so let's not argue it) but I wonder how
> often PII is really needed for authorization with oauth. My guess
> would be that its needed far less often than its found to be
> profitable perhaps, or that carelessness plays a big role in
> using PII for such purposes.