Return-Path: <binnyjeshan@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: pwe3@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: pwe3@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix)
 with ESMTP id EDB799E8012; Mon, 13 Jun 2011 06:31:30 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.998
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5
 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_29=0.6,
 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com
 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yrOPAFa9RBqN;
 Mon, 13 Jun 2011 06:31:29 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-yi0-f44.google.com (mail-yi0-f44.google.com
 [209.85.218.44]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B5099E8007;
 Mon, 13 Jun 2011 06:31:29 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by yie30 with SMTP id 30so1205845yie.31 for <multiple recipients>;
 Mon, 13 Jun 2011 06:31:28 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma;
 h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date
 :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type;
 bh=zqg45oH2ohCDPaIYxZTNC7ujPGS4+h5d2kLCSSqUpE0=;
 b=dIsUOwujnmO+5iLY5bMdvXdMorKMlGkOQjZLJqheWmdjUFitEEzZg493dPsER/6mh7
 Y1n3zPoJg5yuW7jkuha38h3d3LsWrTRfKiwCHakjfsYkDmry7vM0s1wvMWnS7Ya1Nk6F
 GtWe/exVtX4LaDTJcWVZQ0s/RzXTY7XK4TGqY=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma;
 h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to
 :cc:content-type;
 b=NuP8CpQ14OuyNlC/+1jhAVOLez4woWH4lsV5aL9uBEljEhOKXNQTB0feGR5tN5Kitk
 JPCydTwbX17Wv0swYuxRERMHJxs2gRtu4su0ZTiOlQvUSJiVRIXa2LN7QNDxqEljips2
 bMUFPCiDqZDVW8wRm1Na8JMggUCT+GvG5ob5U=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.101.175.33 with SMTP id c33mr5054575anp.93.1307971888682;
 Mon, 13 Jun 2011 06:31:28 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.100.226.6 with HTTP; Mon, 13 Jun 2011 06:31:28 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <077E41CFFD002C4CAB7DFA4386A5326403F64953@DEMUEXC014.nsn-intra.net>
References: <OF7EF3F6D6.7AE4C202-ON482578AE.00430DDE-482578AE.0044404E@zte.com.cn>
 <A3C5DF08D38B6049839A6F553B331C76E9BDCA9A38@ILPTMAIL02.ecitele.com>
 <077E41CFFD002C4CAB7DFA4386A5326403F64953@DEMUEXC014.nsn-intra.net>
Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2011 19:01:28 +0530
Message-ID: <BANLkTi=WR1tojQ69E9tG6n9geRvVXMc50g@mail.gmail.com>
From: binny jeshan <binnyjeshan@gmail.com>
To: "Sprecher, Nurit (NSN - IL/Hod HaSharon)" <nurit.sprecher@nsn.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001636c5c006cd168904a597efba
Cc: pwe3@ietf.org, mpls@ietf.org, ma.yuxia@zte.com.cn
Subject: Re: [PWE3] [mpls] Seeking feedback on I-D "MPLS-TP LinearProtection
 Applicability to MS-PW"
X-BeenThere: pwe3@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Pseudo Wires Edge to Edge <pwe3.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/pwe3>,
 <mailto:pwe3-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/pwe3>
List-Post: <mailto:pwe3@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:pwe3-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pwe3>,
 <mailto:pwe3-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2011 13:31:31 -0000

--001636c5c006cd168904a597efba
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Hello,

Though on one side I'd think its costlier to do a MS-PW level protection
considering the resource usages, pre-configuration and monitoring overload,
on the other i would think - why wouldn't having such a mechanism help in
case if a local repair procedure fails ( failure in protection switch) for a
underlying broken LSP or a mid-PW segment. A provider would never hesitate
look into his pocket to have an end-end level protection considering a risky
situation for an high priority service that he runs on the MS-PW. Wouldn't
he? I believe he could be only concerned in the view of giving precedence to
efficient switching the server layers, and not messing up with multiple
switches happening for one failure.

-Binny.

On 13 June 2011 18:32, Sprecher, Nurit (NSN - IL/Hod HaSharon) <
nurit.sprecher@nsn.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I would like to second Sasha.
>
> End-to-end PW protection (with diverse paths) does not scale, and put hard
> restrictions on the utilization of the resources.
>
> MPLS-TP PWs are carried across the network inside MPLS-TP LSPs. Therefore,
> an obvious way to provide protection for a PW is to protect the LSP that
> carries it.
>
> If the PW is a multi-segment PW, then LSP recovery can only protect the PW
> in individual segments.  This means that a single LSP recovery action cannot
> protect against a failure of a PW switching point (an S-PE).
>
> When protecting against an AC or T/S-PE failure by dual connectivity, PW
> redundancy mechanisms provide means for the PEs to coordinate over which LSP
> the traffic of the PW is carried.
>
> I also doubt why there is a need for additional mechanism.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Nurit
>
>
>
> *From:* pwe3-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:pwe3-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of
> *ext Alexander Vainshtein
> *Sent:* Monday, June 13, 2011 3:43 PM
> *To:* ma.yuxia@zte.com.cn
> *Cc:* mpls@ietf.org; pwe3@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [PWE3] [mpls] Seeking feedback on I-D "MPLS-TP
> LinearProtection Applicability to MS-PW"
>
>
>
> Dear Ma and all,
>
> Adding the PWE3 WG to my response.
>
>
>
> The PW redundancy mechanism supports linear protection of MS-PWs as one of
> many additional application use cases:
>
> Appendix A of the PW redundancy Bit draft<http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-bit/?include_text=1>describes 5 application uses cases in addition to MS-PW with single-homed
> CEs (which is listed there as use case 5).
>
> And it is equally applicable to IP/MPLS and MPLS - with the help of  the Static
> PW Status Messages draft<http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pwe3-static-pw-status/?include_text=1>(
> if, for whatever reason, you do not want  to, or cannot, use RFC 4447<http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/rfc4447/?include_text=1>
> ).
>
>
>
> Hence I doubt the need for yet another PW redundancy  mechanism with narrow
> scope of applicability.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>      Sasha
>
>
>
> *From:* mpls-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:mpls-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of
> *ma.yuxia@zte.com.cn
> *Sent:* Monday, June 13, 2011 3:25 PM
> *To:* mpls@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [mpls] Seeking feedback on I-D "MPLS-TP Linear Protection
> Applicability to MS-PW"
>
>
>
> Hi all,
>
> The linear protection mechanism for LSP and PW(including MS-PW) should be
> the same and it is valuable to describe it clearly.
>
> BTW, there is a typo, it is "T-PE Z" instead of "T-PE B".
>
>  "
>   Figure 1 illustrates such a scenario, where two MS-PWs are
>   established between T-PE A and T-PE B, over S-PEs 1-2 and 3-4
>   respectively. Each PW segment is established over an LSP (e.g. PW-
>   s12 over LSP12).
>  "
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Daniel Cohn
> Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2011 4:14 PM
> To: mpls
> Subject: Seeking feedback on I-D "MPLS-TP Linear Protection
> Applicability to MS-PW"
> Importance: High
>
> Hi MPLSers,
>
> I uploaded "MPLS-TP Linear Protection Applicability to MS-PW" I-D
> (http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-cohn-mpls-tp-pw-protection-00)
>
> The abstract goes:
>
> One of the requirements of the MPLS transport profile [RFC 5654] is
> to provide linear protection for transport paths, which include both
> LSPs and PWs. The functional architecture described in [SurvivFwk]
> is applicable to both LSP and PWs, however [LinearProt] does not
> explicitly describe mechanisms for PW protection in MPLS-TP.
>
> This document extends the applicability of the linear protection
> mechanism described in [LinearProt] to MPLS-TP segmented PWs
> (MS-PWs) as defined in [RFC 6073].
>
> Could you please review it and send feedback to the mailing list or
> directly to the author?
>
> Looking forward to your feedback,
>
> Daniel
>
> This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains
> information which is CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI
> Telecom. If you have received this transmission in error, please inform us
> by e-mail, phone or fax, and then delete the original and all copies
> thereof.
>
> _______________________________________________
> mpls mailing list
> mpls@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls
>
>

--001636c5c006cd168904a597efba
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hello,<br>
<br>
Though on one side I&#39;d think its costlier to do a MS-PW level protectio=
n
 considering the resource usages, pre-configuration and monitoring=20
overload, on the other i would think - why wouldn&#39;t having such a=20
mechanism help in case if a local repair procedure fails ( failure in prote=
ction=20
switch) for a underlying broken LSP or a mid-PW segment. A provider=20
would never hesitate look into his pocket to have an end-end level=20
protection considering a risky situation for an high priority service=20
that he runs on the MS-PW. Wouldn&#39;t he? I believe he could be only conc=
erned in the view of giving precedence to efficient switching the server la=
yers, and not messing up with multiple switches happening for one failure.<=
br>

<br>
-Binny.<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 13 June 2011 18:32, Sprecher, =
Nurit (NSN - IL/Hod HaSharon) <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:nurit=
.sprecher@nsn.com">nurit.sprecher@nsn.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockqu=
ote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc s=
olid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-US"><div><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Hi,</span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">I would like =
to second Sasha.</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">End-t=
o-end PW protection (with diverse paths) does not scale, and put hard restr=
ictions on the utilization of the resources. =A0</span></p><p class=3D"MsoN=
ormal">
<span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">MPLS-TP PWs are carried acro=
ss the network inside MPLS-TP LSPs. Therefore, an obvious way to provide pr=
otection for a PW is to protect the LSP that carries it.=A0 </span></p><p c=
lass=3D"MsoNormal">
<span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">If the PW is a multi-segment=
 PW, then LSP recovery can only protect the PW in individual segments.=A0 T=
his means that a single LSP recovery action cannot protect against a failur=
e of a PW switching point (an S-PE).</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">When =
protecting against an AC or T/S-PE failure by dual connectivity, PW redunda=
ncy mechanisms provide means for the PEs to coordinate over which LSP the t=
raffic of the PW is carried. </span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">I als=
o doubt why there is a need for additional mechanism. </span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Best regards,=
</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Nurit=
</span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F=
497D">=A0</span></p><div><div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF=
 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt">From:</span></b>=
<span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt"> <a href=3D"mailto:pwe3-bounces@ietf.org" =
target=3D"_blank">pwe3-bounces@ietf.org</a> [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:pwe3-=
bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">pwe3-bounces@ietf.org</a>] <b>On Behalf=
 Of </b>ext Alexander Vainshtein<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, June 13, 2011 3:43 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:=
ma.yuxia@zte.com.cn" target=3D"_blank">ma.yuxia@zte.com.cn</a><br><b>Cc:</b=
> <a href=3D"mailto:mpls@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">mpls@ietf.org</a>; <a =
href=3D"mailto:pwe3@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">pwe3@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [PWE3] [mpls] Seeking feedback on I-D &quot;MPLS-TP Lin=
earProtection Applicability to MS-PW&quot;</span></p></div></div><div><div>=
</div><div class=3D"h5"><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Dear Ma and all,</span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Addin=
g the PWE3 WG to my response.</span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">=A0</span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><s=
pan style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">The PW redundancy mechanism su=
pports linear protection of MS-PWs as one of many additional application us=
e cases:</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Appen=
dix A of the <a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pwe3-red=
undancy-bit/?include_text=3D1" target=3D"_blank">PW redundancy Bit draft</a=
> describes 5 application uses cases in addition to MS-PW with single-homed=
 CEs (which is listed there as use case 5).</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">And i=
t is equally applicable to IP/MPLS and MPLS - with the help of =A0the <a hr=
ef=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pwe3-static-pw-status/?inc=
lude_text=3D1" target=3D"_blank">Static PW Status Messages draft</a>( if, f=
or whatever reason, you do not want =A0to, or cannot, use <a href=3D"http:/=
/datatracker.ietf.org/doc/rfc4447/?include_text=3D1" target=3D"_blank">RFC =
4447</a>).</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">=A0</=
span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F49=
7D">Hence I doubt the need for yet another PW redundancy =A0mechanism with =
narrow scope of applicability.</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">=A0</=
span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F49=
7D">Regards,</span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0=
pt;color:#1F497D">=A0=A0=A0=A0 Sasha</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">=A0</=
span></p><div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm=
 0cm 0cm 4.0pt"><div><div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0=
pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt">From:</span></b>=
<span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt"> <a href=3D"mailto:mpls-bounces@ietf.org" =
target=3D"_blank">mpls-bounces@ietf.org</a> [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:mpls-=
bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">mpls-bounces@ietf.org</a>] <b>On Behalf=
 Of </b><a href=3D"mailto:ma.yuxia@zte.com.cn" target=3D"_blank">ma.yuxia@z=
te.com.cn</a><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, June 13, 2011 3:25 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:=
mpls@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">mpls@ietf.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [=
mpls] Seeking feedback on I-D &quot;MPLS-TP Linear Protection Applicability=
 to MS-PW&quot;</span></p>
</div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p><p><span style=3D"font-size:10.0p=
t">Hi all,</span> <br><br><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt">The </span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:10.0pt">linear protection</span><span style=3D"font-siz=
e:10.0pt"> mechanism for LSP and PW(including MS-PW) should be the same and=
 it is valuable to describe it clearly.</span> <br>
<br><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt">BTW, there is a typo, it is &quot;T-PE=
 Z&quot; instead of &quot;<span style=3D"color:blue">T-PE B</span>&quot;. <=
/span><br><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt"><br>=A0&quot;</span> <span style=
=3D"font-size:10.0pt"><br>
=A0 Figure 1 illustrates such a scenario, where two MS-PWs are</span> <span=
 style=3D"font-size:10.0pt"><br>=A0 established between T-PE A and <span st=
yle=3D"color:blue">T-PE B</span>, over S-PEs 1-2 and 3-4</span> <span style=
=3D"font-size:10.0pt"><br>
=A0 respectively. Each PW segment is established over an LSP (e.g. PW-</spa=
n> <span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt"><br>=A0 s12 over LSP12).</span> <span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt"><br>=A0&quot;</span> </p><p><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt">-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Daniel Cohn <br>Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2011 4:14 PM<br>To: mpls<br>Su=
bject: Seeking feedback on I-D &quot;MPLS-TP Linear Protection<br>Applicabi=
lity to MS-PW&quot;<br>Importance: High<br><br>Hi MPLSers,<br><br>I uploade=
d &quot;MPLS-TP Linear Protection Applicability to MS-PW&quot; I-D<br>
(<a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-cohn-mpls-tp-pw-protection-00"=
 target=3D"_blank">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-cohn-mpls-tp-pw-protect=
ion-00</a>)<br><br>The abstract goes:</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt=
;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"><br>
</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt"><br>One of the requirements of the =
MPLS transport profile [RFC 5654] is<br>to provide linear protection for tr=
ansport paths, which include both<br>LSPs and PWs. The functional architect=
ure described in [SurvivFwk]<br>
is applicable to both LSP and PWs, however [LinearProt] does not<br>explici=
tly describe mechanisms for PW protection in MPLS-TP.</span><span style=3D"=
font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"><br></span><span styl=
e=3D"font-size:10.0pt"><br>
This document extends the applicability of the linear protection<br>mechani=
sm described in [LinearProt] to MPLS-TP segmented PWs <br>(MS-PWs) as defin=
ed in [RFC 6073].<br><br>Could you please review it and send feedback to th=
e mailing list or<br>
directly to the author? <br><br>Looking forward to your feedback, <br><br>D=
aniel</span> </p></div><p>This e-mail message is intended for the recipient=
 only and contains information which is CONFIDENTIAL and which may be propr=
ietary to ECI Telecom. If you have received this transmission in error, ple=
ase inform us by e-mail, phone or fax, and then delete the original and all=
 copies thereof. </p>
</div></div></div></div><br>_______________________________________________=
<br>
mpls mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:mpls@ietf.org">mpls@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br>

--001636c5c006cd168904a597efba--
