[Rai-discuss] TSV BOF request under consideration: SAFE
Magnus Westerlund <magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com> Mon, 08 October 2007 15:31 UTC
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.3-dwing_2006_d (2007-08-08) on dwing-wxp01.cisco.com
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Bayes-Spam: 0.949-+--H*RU:sk:sj-inbo, 0.949-+--H*RT:sk:sj-inbo, 0.944-+--H*RT:128.107.243.13, 0.939-+--HAuthentication-Results:neutral, 0.933-+--HX-Spam-Relays-Internal:128.107.243.13
X-Spam-Status: No, Score=-102.3/5.0, AWL=0.022,BAYES_00=-2.312, LOCAL_ALWAYSTRUE=0.01,USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100, autolearn=no
X-Spam-RBL:
X-Spam-UnTrusted: [ ip=156.154.16.145 rdns=stiedprmman1.ietf.org helo=megatron.ietf.org by=sj-inbound-d.cisco.com ident= envfrom= intl=0 id= auth= msa=0 ] [ ip=127.0.0.1 rdns= helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com by=megatron.ietf.org ident= envfrom= intl=0 id=1IeuZ4-00067n-6P auth= msa=0 ] [ ip=10.91.34.44 rdns= helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org by=megatron.ietf.org ident= envfrom= intl=0 id=1IeuZ3-00063O-BT auth= msa=0 ] [ ip=193.180.251.62 rdns=mailgw4.ericsson.se helo=mailgw4.ericsson.se by=ietf-mx.ietf.org ident= envfrom= intl=0 id=1IeuYt-0002RU-Cv auth= msa=0 ] [ ip=127.0.0.1 rdns= helo=mailgw4.ericsson.se by=mailgw4.ericsson.se ident= envfrom= intl=0 id=C809F21528 auth= msa=0 ] [ ip=153.88.254.124 rdns= helo=esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se by=mailgw4.ericsson.se ident= envfrom= intl=0 id=A31D321527 auth= msa=0 ] [ ip=153.88.254.171 rdns= helo=esealmw127.eemea.ericsson.se by=esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se ident= envfrom= intl=0 id= auth= msa=0 ] [ ip=147.214.30.247 rdns= helo=!147.214.30.247! by=esealmw127.eemea.ericsson.se ident= envfrom= intl=0 id= auth= msa=0 ]
X-Spam-Bayes-Summ: summary=Tokens: new, 82; hammy, 144; neutral, 196; spammy, 7.
Received: from xbh-sjc-211.amer.cisco.com ([171.70.151.144]) by xmb-sjc-22a.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 8 Oct 2007 08:31:06 -0700
Received: from sj-iport-2.cisco.com ([171.71.176.71]) by xbh-sjc-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 8 Oct 2007 08:31:05 -0700
Received: from sj-dkim-1.cisco.com ([171.71.179.21]) by sj-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 08 Oct 2007 08:31:04 -0700
Received: from sj-core-3.cisco.com (sj-core-3.cisco.com [171.68.223.137]) by sj-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l98FV4cj013831; Mon, 8 Oct 2007 08:31:04 -0700
Received: from sj-inbound-d.cisco.com (sj-inbound-d.cisco.com [128.107.243.13]) by sj-core-3.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id l98FV3q9016399; Mon, 8 Oct 2007 15:31:04 GMT
X-from-outside-Cisco: 156.154.16.145
X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true
X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgAAAE7qCUecmhCRmGdsb2JhbACOQwIBAQcEBhEW
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.21,243,1188802800"; d="scan'208";a="34632143"
Received: from stiedprmman1.ietf.org (HELO megatron.ietf.org) ([156.154.16.145]) by sj-inbound-d.cisco.com with ESMTP; 08 Oct 2007 08:31:00 -0700
Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IeuZ4-00067n-6P; Mon, 08 Oct 2007 11:30:38 -0400
Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IeuZ3-00063O-BT for rai-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 08 Oct 2007 11:30:37 -0400
Received: from mailgw4.ericsson.se ([193.180.251.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IeuYt-0002RU-Cv for rai-discuss@ietf.org; Mon, 08 Oct 2007 11:30:34 -0400
Received: from mailgw4.ericsson.se (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id C809F21528; Mon, 8 Oct 2007 17:30:16 +0200 (CEST)
X-AuditID: c1b4fb3e-b1837bb0000007e1-d9-470a4d08f5b5
Received: from esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se (unknown [153.88.254.124]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id A31D321527; Mon, 8 Oct 2007 17:30:16 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from esealmw127.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.171]) by esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 8 Oct 2007 17:30:16 +0200
Received: from [147.214.30.247] ([147.214.30.247]) by esealmw127.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 8 Oct 2007 17:30:16 +0200
Message-ID: <470A4D07.7080806@ericsson.com>
Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2007 17:30:15 +0200
From: Magnus Westerlund <magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com>
User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (Windows/20070728)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: rai-discuss@ietf.org
X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.3
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Oct 2007 15:30:16.0414 (UTC) FILETIME=[2086DFE0:01C809C0]
X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA==
X-Scan-Signature: 10ba05e7e8a9aa6adb025f426bef3a30
Cc: Lars Eggert <lars.eggert@nokia.com>
Subject: [Rai-discuss] TSV BOF request under consideration: SAFE
X-BeenThere: rai-discuss@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5
Precedence: list
List-Id: Discussion list for Realtime Applications and Infrastructure <rai-discuss.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rai-discuss>, <mailto:rai-discuss-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/private/rai-discuss>
List-Post: <mailto:rai-discuss@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rai-discuss-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rai-discuss>, <mailto:rai-discuss-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: rai-discuss-bounces@ietf.org
Authentication-Results: sj-dkim-1; header.From=magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com; dkim=neutral
Return-Path: rai-discuss-bounces@ietf.org
Hi RAI people, I think this is in your interest also. We TSV ADs have received a request for a BOF in Vancouver: SAFE - Self-Address Fixing Evolution. See description below. I would appreciate any feedback on this. For public discussion please use the SAFE mailing list. Post: safe@ietf.org Subscribe: https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/safe Draft: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-wing-behave-nat-control-stun-usage-03.txt SAFE - Self-Address Fixing Evolution ------------------------------------ Chairs: TBD ICE and its companion protocol STUN have been successfully deployed on the Internet for NAT traversal. ICE and STUN have several characteristics which contribute to their success: 1. incremental deployment. ICE and STUN are functional without any modifications to existing NATs. 2. nested NATs. ICE and STUN work when there are multiple NATs between a host and the Internet. 3. topology unaware. ICE and STUN are not configured with information about NATs, firewalls, or their locations -- only with the IP address of a server on the Internet. 4. simple security model. If a host behind a NAT is allowed to send a packet across the NAT, it is allowed to receive a response. 5. works on routed networks, which allows operation in both enterprise networks and home networks. Other NAT traversal protocols do not share these characteristics, which hinders their widespread deployment. Specifically, * incremental deployment is not possible with MIDCOM, NSIS-NSLP, UPnP, or Bonjour. With all of these protocols, both the NAT and the endpoint have to support the same protocol. * nested NATs are not possible with UPnP or Bonjour. * topology awareness is required of MIDCOM. * security must be established between the controlling entity and the NAT for MIDCOM and NSIS-NSLP. * Both UPnP and Bonjour use broadcast packets which don't work well on routed networks. However, a drawback of ICE/STUN is its chatty keepalive traffic, which is a result of STUN not knowing the binding lifetime of its on-path NATs. This chattiness causes a burden on servers and consumes network bandwidth, which is especially critical on wireless networks. It is desirable to reduce this chattiness while still retaining the important characteristics of STUN and ICE. This BoF is intended to discuss one proposed technique, draft-wing-behave-nat-control-stun-usage, which nearly eliminates STUN's keepalive chatter and still preserves the desirable characteristics of STUN/ICE. The purpose of this BoF is to create a working group for this effort. Agenda: Introduction, Agenda .................................... 5 Summary of existing NAT traversal techniques ............ 40 (UPnP, NAT-PMP/Bonjour, MIDCOM techniques, NSIS-NSLP, ICE) draft-wing-behave-nat-control-stun-usage ................ 40 Q&A ..................................................... 25 ---------- total: 110 Cheers Magnus Westerlund IETF Transport Area Director & TSVWG Chair ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Multimedia Technologies, Ericsson Research EAB/TVM/M ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Ericsson AB | Phone +46 8 4048287 Torshamsgatan 23 | Fax +46 8 7575550 S-164 80 Stockholm, Sweden | mailto: magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ Rai-discuss mailing list Rai-discuss@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rai-discuss
- [Rai-discuss] TSV BOF request under consideration… Magnus Westerlund