[Rats] A note on consensus
"Smith, Ned" <ned.smith@intel.com> Fri, 03 June 2022 18:19 UTC
Return-Path: <ned.smith@intel.com>
X-Original-To: rats@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rats@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84C32C14F74E for <rats@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 3 Jun 2022 11:19:08 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.87
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.87 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.745, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=intel.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zW2Pj47iAh7k for <rats@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 3 Jun 2022 11:19:04 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mga01.intel.com (mga01.intel.com [192.55.52.88]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E8AB1C14F6E7 for <rats@ietf.org>; Fri, 3 Jun 2022 11:19:03 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=intel.com; i=@intel.com; q=dns/txt; s=Intel; t=1654280344; x=1685816344; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version; bh=9ltSeHSCbRZtbOdsyo5XjwlprkKsJXolTIMmjY8dPdE=; b=KWxHqNYeLXSLyiyqNnmLAuDxYXqpbzMccjv7aDWoOSFpU6Da+JNxuK61 o6Nu3hvjeojPfaKR4xB+/mSQmBMpW4sw8lRbNDDbbFkQIEw5/6rgC7qP7 dvv/U0gO+FxepQSAY2eCvKBomztLqODxHooadxD3TdHXXKeoK2zrn6elb XtRg2MbcDwvNrL19IroWG9Be7rp8ACUOOZtmlpV8CGb9Q1JtYWZ6MhbQ+ z4SK/cUVfJ8jN2yk1HrmlaUDj/h1DfvtyZ5s8Sq1zCxjTEqM1kBDziftF JnRfcoRLz/a3/zQzlSFCHqihFFbb5o/5y0KqtGB+eGtnb+8PM5Kj58/EB A==;
X-IronPort-AV: E=McAfee;i="6400,9594,10367"; a="301691537"
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.91,275,1647327600"; d="scan'208,217";a="301691537"
Received: from fmsmga002.fm.intel.com ([10.253.24.26]) by fmsmga101.fm.intel.com with ESMTP/TLS/ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 03 Jun 2022 11:19:00 -0700
X-ExtLoop1: 1
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.91,275,1647327600"; d="scan'208,217";a="681277013"
Received: from orsmsx606.amr.corp.intel.com ([10.22.229.19]) by fmsmga002.fm.intel.com with ESMTP; 03 Jun 2022 11:19:00 -0700
Received: from orsmsx611.amr.corp.intel.com (10.22.229.24) by ORSMSX606.amr.corp.intel.com (10.22.229.19) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.2308.27; Fri, 3 Jun 2022 11:18:59 -0700
Received: from orsmsx604.amr.corp.intel.com (10.22.229.17) by ORSMSX611.amr.corp.intel.com (10.22.229.24) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.2308.27; Fri, 3 Jun 2022 11:18:58 -0700
Received: from ORSEDG602.ED.cps.intel.com (10.7.248.7) by orsmsx604.amr.corp.intel.com (10.22.229.17) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.2308.27 via Frontend Transport; Fri, 3 Jun 2022 11:18:59 -0700
Received: from NAM02-SN1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (104.47.57.48) by edgegateway.intel.com (134.134.137.103) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.1.2308.27; Fri, 3 Jun 2022 11:18:58 -0700
ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=JBFVWTPluvGFivrgyYmmrnBZub9P0hxSYdya/jV/LahE6HLOGimjalaW8V8PHMYrbJ0U7/mGej3oUvyjk9wJTnKmeg9o4QQwv6SgGBSFn9yPOSYMvfZvJRwjOyeLCsxrZI7LQ0Hfj6JbJj+mw7+VOwYGawy8LaqDmUR/BiInnscXESzePDP8MvHGYeS0FvX5hCl/hwnarwrDu2WCC5Z590kLJWxb+kcQuOZm+LR06EHB+WvoIEPpqh7jcj7CEuS1waca0dsigduBCcDplf/Z6uzYMgLblMOLpoNQphZp5Sm1BqTdsq5nSwjvjDMo84nrl1B/aGUGpSlblTzXoIBt8Q==
ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-1; bh=9ltSeHSCbRZtbOdsyo5XjwlprkKsJXolTIMmjY8dPdE=; b=HkrytruZlnblGPrPm7H7zQh6H8FCFvqZYW3U1lT1o3zjyHcG3wzGgLa2A+ezgxdpCxCC8uusR3mlHNvp8JBlXUqTzYrcyufcqa3sIilPa34zWCWq67/bF6gWkzNdPADv9LpJzfLWEdYxI3MvQCGW2GHpa1IXRIkEwl2LwMQOEnlMhZQ8lad6Z2gu98mHOsnjjv6pddsni3G4oA0B4WjlFuZnEnAM+g29TlBNOKNQNiLN6Kv9ltNB2iLDzvzGA2Soq9rtCJQ31O2eLI1AVKE0YAsVUJl499wxApn170uGEmHjmx+N8DBUvW508M6yw4b7Ep6gGY7+ySPBWgtYQlwuuw==
ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=intel.com; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=intel.com; dkim=pass header.d=intel.com; arc=none
Received: from CO1PR11MB5169.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:303:95::19) by DM6PR11MB3068.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:5:6b::18) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.5293.13; Fri, 3 Jun 2022 18:18:57 +0000
Received: from CO1PR11MB5169.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::5dfe:31c7:a62a:d8b8]) by CO1PR11MB5169.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::5dfe:31c7:a62a:d8b8%3]) with mapi id 15.20.5314.013; Fri, 3 Jun 2022 18:18:57 +0000
From: "Smith, Ned" <ned.smith@intel.com>
To: "rats@ietf.org" <rats@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: A note on consensus
Thread-Index: AQHYd3ZjVbnTfuqvYUylD3lbUpprNQ==
Date: Fri, 03 Jun 2022 18:18:57 +0000
Message-ID: <E4EFCA08-2D1D-4E33-92ED-CBA7D2D16396@intel.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/16.61.22050700
authentication-results: dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;dmarc=none action=none header.from=intel.com;
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 73165cf2-e5b1-4011-7866-08da458d8651
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: DM6PR11MB3068:EE_
x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: <DM6PR11MB3068EA2B9B9CE9C78D0F4D7DE5A19@DM6PR11MB3068.namprd11.prod.outlook.com>
x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1
x-ms-exchange-antispam-relay: 0
x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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
x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255; CTRY:; LANG:en; SCL:1; SRV:; IPV:NLI; SFV:NSPM; H:CO1PR11MB5169.namprd11.prod.outlook.com; PTR:; CAT:NONE; SFS:(13230001)(366004)(186003)(82960400001)(2616005)(166002)(122000001)(83380400001)(6512007)(38070700005)(71200400001)(6506007)(508600001)(26005)(3480700007)(36756003)(6916009)(6486002)(316002)(66476007)(66556008)(66446008)(64756008)(76116006)(5660300002)(8676002)(66946007)(2906002)(8936002)(38100700002)(86362001)(33656002)(4744005)(45980500001); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102;
x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1
x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: 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
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_E4EFCA082D1D4E3392EDCBA7D2D16396intelcom_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: CO1PR11MB5169.namprd11.prod.outlook.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 73165cf2-e5b1-4011-7866-08da458d8651
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 03 Jun 2022 18:18:57.2381 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 46c98d88-e344-4ed4-8496-4ed7712e255d
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: Cqn/+OjOusGxz+nj6mXFtpBHFnSNlv3pgbzwJJQQPUprESaBMO3MjEzX1sA228EaabK9RDjJDrqpeus2zdeEdA==
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DM6PR11MB3068
X-OriginatorOrg: intel.com
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rats/9TPt1f-PABLTRolTYGa2o03_9AM>
Subject: [Rats] A note on consensus
X-BeenThere: rats@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: Remote ATtestation procedureS <rats.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/rats>, <mailto:rats-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/rats/>
List-Post: <mailto:rats@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rats-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rats>, <mailto:rats-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Jun 2022 18:19:08 -0000
There is a draft defining consensus [1] that does a pretty good job of explaining that rough consensus is when all issues are addressed but not necessarily accommodated. If a WG is split over an issue, even if there are only a few who disagree, that can be an indication of lack of consensus. Those ono the other side of an issue should accept raised issues as requests to address the issues. I interpret recent list activity that points to issues in the archive as someone believes an issue previously raised has not (yet) been addressed (and could also mean not yet accommodated). Specific issues raised should be responded to specifically in terms of how the issue is addressed. If an issue remains that isn’t addressed, then consensus might not be achieved. The WG should suggest ways to address all raised issues. [1] On Consensus and Humming in the IETF<https://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-resnick-on-consensus-01.html#rfc.section.3>
- [Rats] A note on consensus Smith, Ned
- Re: [Rats] A note on consensus Dave Thaler