Re: [Rats] draft-dthaler-rats-endorsements: request for WG adoption?

Carl Wallace <> Fri, 19 May 2023 11:30 UTC

Return-Path: <>
Received: from localhost (localhost []) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B9FEC15152F for <>; Fri, 19 May 2023 04:30:38 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.094
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.094 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, URIBL_DBL_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, URIBL_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key)
Received: from ([]) by localhost ( []) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id r7b2grSh-JGl for <>; Fri, 19 May 2023 04:30:33 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ( [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::732]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CC71FC15153F for <>; Fri, 19 May 2023 04:30:33 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by with SMTP id af79cd13be357-7577a91cfd6so158902585a.3 for <>; Fri, 19 May 2023 04:30:33 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;; s=google; t=1684495832; x=1687087832; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:thread-topic:message-id:to:from :subject:date:user-agent:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=70zyy9DJs0xLBbsvR8kntEnNYEwX2VFgkaJnw+cdTSg=; b=d7kyJqYIjHmElsxXe0G8pLnAapif04Zdk5FBLrMBU6GIagt1O2tzr8FD6pKqUfcu+Y MltsABqgeXARzi6fFlp4SssYccHLGFBp4KAAxv9Ej/dLihFZIz4udScNs1j8/t0+yHiP 2gmBVWToYKc8oLM9B5+JEPuZqAFH4VgebMr14=
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;; s=20221208; t=1684495832; x=1687087832; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:thread-topic:message-id:to:from :subject:date:user-agent:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=70zyy9DJs0xLBbsvR8kntEnNYEwX2VFgkaJnw+cdTSg=; b=jeH69i7DWLo3XOUJX6dknEorthq5MLFTsHIe43iDi6WF2DpnDmU6J1i83Pqt4f3JOb cRTs6vdM+stHkpC7bYlNApjrhhrVR+I2JrgTvYipXgkSu7emvD+HeUc5j2sZJO3/1TWO 2tZxLJcGvFqiEFGdJSH7V5Z/esXaf+BomzDpPRKvwwLa8SDPxjXI2auy32+dDxECDu8e qOH4Q/k/rdiu7iQsrry7Alkoce1tCHXqArldfDG/uF+fmggQms2V5CHW0A6Oj75vAt0Q 8i852UqvbTZTP7a8aD+xTzD5GoDZt4s3O+GRZmLjZ0PQ9Shyd2hxgsCzh+/0ggfSUjJd 7SJQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: AC+VfDxSfypcxVwGEfAYbpuu1Vd3PQsTj52qWRANqXwUMrZNY9JPnipl dANET0fZ/sl0hkK5BNAodR83nA==
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ACHHUZ6YjNAX3TNG7Z6tgRh+clMJ0f9PT4wBxL7zAlTt/gRMmRKS4sYz6FsWsy2zSU0aW5E2CN6+GQ==
X-Received: by 2002:ac8:5795:0:b0:3f4:dfba:821c with SMTP id v21-20020ac85795000000b003f4dfba821cmr2442037qta.34.1684495832425; Fri, 19 May 2023 04:30:32 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [] ( []) by with ESMTPSA id q14-20020a05622a04ce00b003eda962ed24sm1220758qtx.22.2023. (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 19 May 2023 04:30:31 -0700 (PDT)
User-Agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/16.73.23051401
Date: Fri, 19 May 2023 07:30:31 -0400
From: Carl Wallace <>
To: "Smith, Ned" <>, Dave Thaler <>, "" <>
Message-ID: <>
Thread-Topic: [Rats] draft-dthaler-rats-endorsements: request for WG adoption?
References: <> <> <>
In-Reply-To: <>
Mime-version: 1.0
Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="B_3767326231_3819090395"
Archived-At: <>
Subject: Re: [Rats] draft-dthaler-rats-endorsements: request for WG adoption?
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: Remote ATtestation procedureS <>
List-Unsubscribe: <>, <>
List-Archive: <>
List-Post: <>
List-Help: <>
List-Subscribe: <>, <>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 19 May 2023 11:30:38 -0000

Actual state works for me. Thanks.


From: "Smith, Ned" <>
Date: Thursday, May 18, 2023 at 8:20 PM
To: Dave Thaler <>, Carl Wallace <>, "" <>
Subject: Re: [Rats] draft-dthaler-rats-endorsements: request for WG adoption?


“actual state” seem close to or appropriate for appraised evidence and endorsements. I excluded “evidence” because it is an asserted state that may not be actual until it is appraised. 

“desired state” seems close or appropriate for reference values. 


From: RATS <> on behalf of Dave Thaler <>
Date: Thursday, May 18, 2023 at 1:38 PM
To: Carl Wallace <>, "" <>
Subject: Re: [Rats] draft-dthaler-rats-endorsements: request for WG adoption?


Thanks Carl.


For point 1, would “actual state” be ok?   For example discussions like
Academic papers like
All use “desired” vs “actual” (as opposed to “current”).




From: Carl Wallace <> 
Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2023 3:03 AM
To: Dave Thaler <>;
Subject: Re: [Rats] draft-dthaler-rats-endorsements: request for WG adoption?


An informational draft on endorsements seems like a good addition, so I support adoption. Two nits:

I’d prefer “observed state” to “current state” in most places throughout. This would be more consistent with the first sentence in the second paragraph of section 2.
In the next to last paragraph of section 2.1, I’d change “sign Evidence” to “verify Evidence” where discussing trust anchors.

From: RATS <> on behalf of Dave Thaler <>
Date: Tuesday, May 16, 2023 at 11:03 PM
To: "" <>
Subject: [Rats] draft-dthaler-rats-endorsements: request for WG adoption?


draft-dthaler-rats-endorsements-01 is now posted which makes the updates I mentioned
at IETF 116.  Notably it does not mention EAT or CORIM and only discusses endorsements
in general, like my presentation to the WG did, thanks to feedback from Ned and others.


>From IETF 116 minutes:
Dave to make an update, and then will ask for WG adoption.

Now that I have made the update, I would like to ask the WG for adoption.
It is quite short (6 pages).



_______________________________________________ RATS mailing list