Re: [Raven] German programmer "Mixter" addresses cyberattacks

"Richard Payne" <> Tue, 15 February 2000 15:42 UTC

Received: from ( [] (may be forged)) by (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA09989 for <>; Tue, 15 Feb 2000 10:42:03 -0500 (EST)
Received: from (localhost []) by (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA07222; Tue, 15 Feb 2000 09:49:31 -0500 (EST)
Received: from (odin []) by (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA07195 for <>; Tue, 15 Feb 2000 09:49:30 -0500 (EST)
Received: from ( []) by (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA05783 for <>; Tue, 15 Feb 2000 09:51:03 -0500 (EST)
Received: from genesis by with SMTP (peer crosschecked as: []) id QQicnb03221 for <>; Tue, 15 Feb 2000 14:51:03 GMT
Message-ID: <000501bf77c4$0a612fe0$d964c8c7@genesis>
From: "Richard Payne" <>
To: <>
References: <>
Subject: Re: [Raven] German programmer "Mixter" addresses cyberattacks
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 09:50:44 -0500
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailman-Version: 1.0
Precedence: bulk
List-Id: Raven Discussion List <>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

ch*fr*n wrote:

> (Pretty clueless ideas regarding a society as far as I see
> it. It's simply not acceptable for a lawful society that
> vandalists can produce damage worth of millons of dollars
> without much chance of getting cought.)
> It might well be that just tapping personal or business
> communication won't be enough to stop digital vandalism in
> the near future and police needs a sight at the traffic
> like they can look at numberplates of cars in a city...

Using distributed denial of service as yet another rationale for tapping
makes very little sense. The number of zombies involved makes it likely that
the originators of the attacks will eventually be caught. As pointed out by
mixter in the interview, the underlying problem is lax security on the
zombies. The end result will be better security as people become aware of
the potential problems.

ch*fr*n also wrote:

> p.s. I still think Raven might mark the point in time IETF
> lost the  guidance of Internet standards. I don't expect
> IPv6 to take off as we know it (maybe via UTMS with
> absolute(!) addresses), I expect a 5-10 year "standards"
> vacuum without a lot of new things and after that some form
> of government by UN/ETSI or even a new UN guided agency.

The UN running the Internet? Saints preserve us in creosote!

Richard Payne

raven mailing list