Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text
Bob Briscoe <rbriscoe@jungle.bt.co.uk> Sun, 18 October 2009 15:39 UTC
Return-Path: <rbriscoe@jungle.bt.co.uk>
X-Original-To: re-ecn@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: re-ecn@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix)
with ESMTP id 2784B3A689A for <re-ecn@core3.amsl.com>;
Sun, 18 Oct 2009 08:39:01 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.073
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.073 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.444,
BAYES_05=-1.11, DNS_FROM_RFC_BOGUSMX=1.482, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com
[127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LsYxVDYe5F5k for
<re-ecn@core3.amsl.com>; Sun, 18 Oct 2009 08:38:54 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from smtp2.smtp.bt.com (smtp2.smtp.bt.com [217.32.164.150]) by
core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EFEC3A68D5 for <re-ecn@ietf.org>;
Sun, 18 Oct 2009 08:38:53 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from i2kc08-ukbr.domain1.systemhost.net ([193.113.197.71]) by
smtp2.smtp.bt.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);
Sun, 18 Oct 2009 16:38:57 +0100
Received: from cbibipnt08.iuser.iroot.adidom.com ([147.149.100.81]) by
i2kc08-ukbr.domain1.systemhost.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);
Sun, 18 Oct 2009 16:38:58 +0100
Received: From bagheera.jungle.bt.co.uk ([132.146.168.158]) by
cbibipnt08.iuser.iroot.adidom.com (WebShield SMTP v4.5 MR1a P0803.399);
id 1255880337202; Sun, 18 Oct 2009 16:38:57 +0100
Received: from MUT.jungle.bt.co.uk ([10.73.192.171]) by
bagheera.jungle.bt.co.uk (8.13.5/8.12.8) with ESMTP id n9IFcFBS024127;
Sun, 18 Oct 2009 16:38:35 +0100
Message-Id: <200910181538.n9IFcFBS024127@bagheera.jungle.bt.co.uk>
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.1.0.9
Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2009 16:38:16 +0100
To: Leslie Daigle <leslie@thinkingcat.com>
From: Bob Briscoe <rbriscoe@jungle.bt.co.uk>
In-Reply-To: <4AD933B1.3030909@thinkingcat.com>
References: <AEDCAF87EEC94F49BA92EBDD49854CC70D88A995@E03MVZ1-UKDY.domain1.systemhost.net>
<4AD933B1.3030909@thinkingcat.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.56 on 132.146.168.158
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Oct 2009 15:38:58.0144 (UTC)
FILETIME=[1B994E00:01CA5009]
Cc: re-ecn@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text
X-BeenThere: re-ecn@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: re-inserted explicit congestion notification <re-ecn.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/re-ecn>,
<mailto:re-ecn-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/re-ecn>
List-Post: <mailto:re-ecn@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:re-ecn-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/re-ecn>,
<mailto:re-ecn-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2009 15:39:01 -0000
Leslie, Thanks for this. Had you noticed that most of the linked refs are repeated a little further down the page (and one or two of the original links need to point to revved versions)? Shall I tidy up, or would you rather? Comments (minor) on the text itself next. Bob At 04:02 17/10/2009, Leslie Daigle wrote: >Hi, > >I've posted a description on the BoF wiki page: > >http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/tsv/trac/wiki/re-ECN > >I think I mostly followed the structural edits, but not the wording >changes within sentences, because I felt there were important (if >subtle) changes that I wasn't convinced about/would want further >input from the list for. But -- it's a wiki. We can change the >text, if there's need to do so! > >Thanks, >Leslie. > >> >>Suggested edited version (slightly shorter and it moves references >>to re-ECN further towards the end. Also tries to tighten up the text a bit): >> >>Congestion Exposure (ConEx) is a proposed new IETF activity that >>reveals congestion along the forwarding path of the Internet. By >>revealing the expected congestion in the IP header of every packet, >>congestion exposure provides a new generic network capability. We >>believe such information could be used for many purposes, including >>congestion policing, accountability and inter-domain SLAs. It may >>also open new approaches to QoS and traffic engineering. >> >>The Internet is, in essence, about pooling and sharing resources. >>This has been paramount to its success and has traditionally been >>managed through the voluntary use of TCP congestion >>control. However, TCP alone is unable to prevent bandwidth >>intensive applications, such as peer-to-peer or streaming video, >>from causing enough congestion to severely limit the >>user-experience of many other end-hosts. This has led ISPs to >>deploy ad-hoc solutions such as volume accounting, rate policing >>and deep packet inspection in an attempt to distribute capacity >>differently. Such practices are leading to calls for government >>regulation as well as stifling innovation at the transport and >>application layer (see for example, the problem statement I-D (ref >>below) and RFC5594). >> >>We believe these problems stem from the lack of accountability for >>causing congestion at the network layer. We propose a metric where >>all IP packets carry information about the expected rest-of-path >>congestion, so that any network node may estimate how much >>congestion it will cause by forwarding traffic. This will allow >>network operators to count the volume of congestion about to be >>caused as easily as the volume of bytes in any aggregate of >>traffic. Once ISPs can see rest-of-path congestion, they can >>actively discourage users from causing excessive congestion, >>encourage other networks to control the congestion their customers >>cause, and more meaningfully differentiate between the qualities of >>services offered by potential connectivity partners. Meanwhile >>end-hosts can be freed from rate restrictions so long as they >>control the overall congestion they cause. >> >>The purpose of this BoF is to explore whether the IETF community >>agrees this lack of congestion exposure is a problem and to gauge >>the support for and viability of pursuing an IETF activity to >>define a basic protocol to expose the expected rest-of-path >>congestion in the IP header. Any such protocol should work with >>minimal changes to the existing network; in particular it should >>work with unmodified routers. There is already one existing >>proposal that builds on ECN to provide rest-of-path congestion >>information in every IP header and other proposals may come forward. >> >>If supported, an eventual WG would focus on developing such a >>protocol as its main work item. Additional work items could >>include detailing the motivations for congestion exposure, a threat >>analysis of the protocol, providing feedback on experimental trials >>and describing deployment considerations. Importantly, the proposed >>WG would encourage experimentation but not deliberate on how >>congestion exposure should be used: our concern would be how >>flexibly the resulting protocol can support differing needs at >>run-time, rather than dictating a particular usage at design time. >> >> >>*From:* re-ecn-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:re-ecn-bounces@ietf.org] >>*On Behalf Of *philip.eardley@bt.com >>*Sent:* 16 October 2009 11:28 >>*To:* re-ecn@ietf.org >>*Subject:* [re-ECN] ConEx BoF announcement text >> >>Here's a slightly revised version of the announcement text - thanks >>to Joao and everyone who worked on it. >> >>The main change was to re-write the last 2 paras from the >>perspective of the BoF. I also deleted the claim that the work >>should be transport-agnostic, as I find 'transport' an ambiguous >>word & also think the substantive point is already made by saying >>the congestion is revealed in the IP header. >> >>Please send any further suggestions asap, so we can circulate to >>other mailing lists later today >> >>Thanks >>Phil & Leslie >> >>--- >> >>Congestion Exposure (ConEx) is a proposed new IETF activity to >>enable congestion to be exposed along the forwarding path of the >>Internet. By revealing expected congestion in the IP header of >>every packet, congestion exposure provides a generic network >>capability which allows greater freedom over how capacity is shared. >> >> >> >>An existing proposal, building on ECN to reveal "rest-of-path" >>information into the IP header, has already demonstrated how >>congestion exposure can give an incentive to control one's impact >>on the network beside TCP congestion-control. We believe this >>"congestion exposure" information may be used for many purposes, >>including congestion policing, accountability and inter-domain >>SLAs. It may also open new approaches to QoS and traffic engineering. >> >>The Internet is, in essence, about pooling resources. The ability >>to share capacity has been paramount to its success and has >>traditionally been managed through the voluntary use of TCP >>congestion control. >>However, TCP alone is unable to prevent bandwidth intensive >>applications, such as peer-to-peer or streaming video, from causing >>enough congestion to severely limit the user-experience of many >>other end-hosts. This has led ISPs to deploy ad-hoc solutions such >>as volume accounting, rate policing and deep packet inspection in >>an attempt to distribute capacity differently. The consequences of >>such practices are increasingly leading to calls for government >>regulations and stifling innovation at the transport and >>application layer (see for example, the problem statement I-D (ref >>below) and RFC5594). >> >>We believe these problems stem from the lack of a network-layer >>system for accountability -- among all parties -- for sending >>traffic which causes congestion. We propose a metric where IP >>packets carry information about the expected rest-of-path >>congestion, so that any network node may estimate how much >>congestion it is likely to cause by forwarding traffic. A network >>operator can then count the volume of congestion about to be caused >>by an aggregate of traffic as easily as it can count the volume of >>bytes entering its network today. Once ISPs can see rest-of-path >>congestion, they can actively discourage users from causing large >>volumes of congestion, discourage other networks from allowing >>their users to cause congestion, and more meaningfully >>differentiate between the qualities of services offered from >>potential connectivity partners. Meanwhile end-hosts may be freed >>from rate restrictions where their traffic causes little congestion. >> >>The purpose of the BoF is to explore the support for and viability >>of pursuing an IETF activity to define a basic protocol to expose >>the expected rest-of-path congestion in the IP header. Any such >>protocol should work with minimal changes to the existing network, >>in particular it should work with unmodified routers. >> >>If supported, an eventual WG would focus on the development of that >>protocol as its main work item. Additional work items could >>include detailing the motivations for congestion exposure, a threat >>analysis of the subsequent protocol, providing feedback on >>experimental trials and describing deployment considerations. >>Importantly, the proposed WG would encourage experimentation but >>not deliberate on how congestion exposure should be used: our >>concern would be how flexibly the resulting protocol can support >>differing needs at run-time, rather than dictating a particular >>usage at design time. >> >>------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>_______________________________________________ >>re-ECN mailing list >>re-ECN@ietf.org >>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/re-ecn > >-- > >------------------------------------------------------------------- >"Reality: > Yours to discover." > -- ThinkingCat >Leslie Daigle >leslie@thinkingcat.com >------------------------------------------------------------------- >_______________________________________________ >re-ECN mailing list >re-ECN@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/re-ecn ________________________________________________________________ Bob Briscoe, BT Innovate & Design
- [re-ECN] ConEx BoF announcement text philip.eardley
- [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text toby.moncaster
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Leslie Daigle
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Bob Briscoe
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Leslie Daigle
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Bob Briscoe
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Bob Briscoe
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text philip.eardley
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text toby.moncaster
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Leslie Daigle
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text toby.moncaster
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text bmanning
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Leslie Daigle
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Richard Bennett
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Richard Bennett
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text toby.moncaster
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text philip.eardley
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text toby.moncaster
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Kwok Ho Chan
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text João Taveira Araújo
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text John Leslie
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Leslie Daigle
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Bob Briscoe
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Fred Baker
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Ilpo Järvinen
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Fred Baker
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Ilpo Järvinen
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Fred Baker
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Leslie Daigle
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Bob Briscoe
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Bob Briscoe
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Leslie Daigle
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text João Taveira Araújo
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Ilpo Järvinen
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text toby.moncaster
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text Bob Briscoe
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text John Leslie
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text philip.eardley
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text toby.moncaster
- Re: [re-ECN] FW: ConEx BoF announcement text philip.eardley