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Hi Andy,

most (perhaps all) of the extensions proposed so far aim to fix a flaw in RDAP, as defined by the STD95 standard. Therefore, I believe all clients and servers should implement these extensions to make RDAP more efficient and interoperable.

Don't you think the signaling mechanism described in rdap-x-media-type should be implemented by all clients and servers?

IMO the question is whether we truly believe= an extension is useful or not.

Regarding versioning as defined in rdap-versioning, I believe sending a /help query is currently the method used by clients to discover which RDAP features servers implement.

Since these features might change over time, I expect clients to regularly (not before each request, but periodically) send a /help query to synchronize their implementations with those of the servers.

If a server implements the versioning specification, a client can not only check which extensions, but also which versions of those extensions are implemented by the server.


Best,

Mario


Il 09/06/2026 15:53, Andy Newton ha scritto:
Pawel's correct. What you ar=
e advocating is that every client issue /help before issuing queries for =
data and that every client and server now has to support your versioning =
draft. That is not backwards compatible with everything deployed today, a=
nd it puts extra load on servers.

-andy, no hats

On 6/9/26 8:30 AM, Gould, James wrote:

Pawel,

=C2=A0

The client can easily leverage the extension of the help command to obtai=
n the versioning information.=C2=A0 Again, if the client is interested in=
 versioning and breaking/non-breaking information then they can leverage =
the extension.=C2=A0 I don=E2=80=99t see how the extension identifier mit=
igates the breaking change impact, since the proposal is to change the ex=
tension identifier that will certainly break the client looking for the J=
SON members using the prior extension identifier prefix.=C2=A0 Additional=
ly, changing the extension identifier will impact the query elements (pat=
h segment and query parameters).=C2=A0 As Mario pointed out, changing the=
 extension identifier causes maximum breakage, so it=E2=80=99s a very poo=
r versioning signal for interoperability.=C2=A0 The draft-ietf-regext-rda=
p-versioning extension supports the opaque versioning that can only use t=
he extension identifier as a versioning signal, but I believe the point v=
ersioning type in draft-ietf-regext-rdap-versioning provides for a much b=
etter
versioning signal.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

The extension identifier is best suited as a namespace without attempting=
 to embed versioning information, since it=E2=80=99s too coarse grained a=
nd doesn=E2=80=99t provide any standard versioning information.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Thanks,

=C2=A0

=C2=A0--

=C2=A0

JG


cid87442*=
image001.png@01D960C5.C631DA40

*James Gould
*Fellow Engineer
jgould@Verisign.com <applewebdata://13890C55-AAE8-4BF3-A6CE-B4BA42740803/jg=
ould@Verisign.com>

703-948-3271
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190

Verisign.com <http://verisigninc.com/><=
/a>

=C2=A0

*From: *Pawel Kowalik <kowalik=3D=
40denic.de@dmarc.ietf.org>
*Date: *Tuesday, June 9, 2026 at 7:58=E2=80=AFAM
*To: *James Gould <jgould@verisign.com>, "=
regext@ietf.org" &=
lt;regext@ietf.org>
*Subject: *[EXTERNAL] Re: [regext] Re: draft-ietf-regext-rdap-x-media-typ=
e and draft-ietf-regext-rdap-versioning Compatibility Topic 1: Query Iden=
tifiers

=C2=A0

Hi Jim,

this is not my point.

If versioning draft remains an extension, than the breaking/non-breaking =
change problem has to be solved without taking this extension into accoun=
t. This has a consequence of extension identifier as the only capability =
to signal breaking changes.

Kind regards,
Pawel=C2=A0=C2=A0

On 09.06.26 13:42, Gould, James wrote:

    Pawel,

    =C2=A0

    The versioning extension came out of the lack of explicit versioning =
being defined in the base RFCs.=C2=A0 There have been many debates about =
what kind of versioning information to embed in the extension identifier,=
 which has resulted in large inconsistency in the RDAP extension registry=
=2E=C2=A0 The result was adopting draft-ietf-regext-rdap-versioning to pr=
ovide the versioning signaling and capability needed in the protocol.=C2=A0=
 Adding a basic capability to RDAP, like versioning, doesn=E2=80=99t requ=
ire updating the standards, since RDAP is extensible and draft-ietf-regex=
t-rdap-versioning already provides a proposal of how to do it.=C2=A0 Clie=
nts can support draft-ietf-regext-rdap-versioning if versioning is import=
ant to them, where there is no bootstrapping issue.=C2=A0 The compatibili=
ty issues between draft-ietf-regext-rdap-versioning and draft-ietf-regext=
-rdap-x-media-type can be easily addressed if there is a desire to do so.=
=C2=A0 How to fix the incompatibilities have been communicated on the mai=
ling
    list (e.g., support the Extension Version Identifier in the =E2=80=9C=
exts_lists=E2=80=9D parameter and remove Appendix B.2), so the question i=
s whether draft-ietf-regext-rdap-x-media-type will address the incompatib=
ilities.=C2=A0 I propose that draft-ietf-regext-rdap-versioning and draft=
-ietf-regext-rdap-x-media-type be merged, since draft-ietf-regext-rdap-ve=
rsioning is a superset of draft-ietf-regext-rdap-x-media-type and merging=
 them will ensure compatibility.=C2=A0

    =C2=A0

    Thanks,=C2=A0

    =C2=A0

    =C2=A0--

    =C2=A0

    JG


    cid87442*=
image001.png@01D960C5.C631DA40

    *James Gould
    *Fellow Engineer
    jgould@Verisign.com <applewebdata://13890C55-AAE8-4BF3-A6CE-B4BA42740803/jg=
ould@Verisign.com>

    703-948-3271
    12061 Bluemont Way
    Reston, VA 20190

    Verisign.com <http://secure-web.cisco.com/1-ArvJYo5ItPb617dbqm1rQRUNw3VimCCoZf=
dQLvuVk8hxFruFojEZlL7avAKnLmeMJ0NudIvMMqAqwcEvyB7nVlYerZ3Jd1rxh_7zVfq_P5q=
Jlrk4geIAGfGSBmXYCo5LLHucTCACLLjimizmQ3ZqshYGnsHGJA-FDa5Kdmfw3RfCVZ5Zs7Ux=
t8uPHTReGdiI9Rd_K1ArdXDmEHpGnEy6GyDf8RdUrmvzO85cDKtNEzPt877oJnJOuQXxZZgrI=
3OAogjXrzibdrUzXGKq-nJYxZzy-VgZncGKsV-a0EEQmE/http%3A%2F%2Fverisigninc.co=
m%2F>

    =C2=A0

    *From: *Pawel Kowalik <kowalik=3D=
40denic.de@dmarc.ietf.org> <mailto:ko=
walik=3D40denic.de@dmarc.ietf.org>
    *Date: *Tuesday, June 9, 2026 at 2:42=E2=80=AFAM
    *To: *"regext@ietf.org" &=
lt;mailto:regext@ietf.org> &=
lt;regext@ietf.org> &=
lt;mailto:regext@ietf.org>
    *Subject: *[EXTERNAL] [regext] Re: draft-ietf-regext-rdap-x-media-typ=
e and draft-ietf-regext-rdap-versioning Compatibility Topic 1: Query Iden=
tifiers

    =C2=A0

    Hi Mario,

    the points you rise have all merits. They only do not address the iss=
ue of clients not knowing/supporting versioning extension, which must be =
able to tell the difference based on extension identifier itself.

    What you are proposing would require versioning to be an update to th=
e standard (rdap_level_1 or so), not an extension - only then we would be=
 able to build the whole framework around it.

    On the flip side, such coarse-grained versioning can be actually a be=
nefit to the ecosystem as it would encourage extension developers to keep=
 backwards compatibility, so I would be actually in favour of keeping thi=
s bar high.

    Kind Regards,
    Pawel

    On 22.04.26 16:01, Mario Loffredo wrote:

        Hi Andy,

        please find a late comment below.

        Il 14/04/2026 22:04, Andy Newton ha scritto:



            On 14-04-2026 3:19 PM, Gould, James wrote:


                JG-A server supporting an RDAP extension that does use Ma=
turity Versioning in the versioning extension should add support for the =
versioning extension as well.=C2=A0 Clients can then take advantage of th=
e versioning extension to obtain the extension versioning information and=
 request for a specific extension version.=C2=A0 There is a bootstrapping=
 period, but if the client cares about extension versioning it should imp=
lement the versioning extension.


            There is a bootstrapping process to use the versioning extens=
ion? Is this in addition to RFC 9224 or does it take the place of RFC 922=
4?







                    We first looked at defining breaking changes in the v=
ersioning draft with the Semantic Versioning, but it wound up to focus on=
 the major version being associated with stable interface change and the =
minor version being associated with an unstable interface change.

                That's not semantic versioning. I don't know what that is=
, but in semantic versioning major means breaking changes and minor means=
 backwards compatible.

                JG-We changed the name to Maturity Versioning to be clear=
 that it's not semantic versioning based on our meeting at IETF-124.=C2=A0=
 Do you want us to go back to signaling breaking and non-breaking changes=
?


            I'd prefer to go back to the scheme proposed by Pawel, where =
the major means breaking change and it is in the extension identifier (e.=
g. "example1" ) and, consequently the minor does not need to be signaled =
because it always means backwards compatible. Not only is this simpler, b=
ut it potentially allows RDAP extensions that are opaquely versioned righ=
t now ("cidr0", "ttl0", "rirSearch1", etc...) to switch to major/minor ve=
rsioning later on if there is need.=C2=A0

        [ML] I=E2=80=99m not convinced that changing the RDAP extension i=
dentifier for every backward-incompatible change is the right general app=
roach.

        While using a new identifier provides a simple and unambiguous si=
gnal to clients, it effectively turns the extension identifier into a coa=
rse-grained versioning mechanism. This has an important side effect: it c=
ouples together all protocol surfaces of the extension =E2=80=94 request =
parameters, response structure, conformance signaling, and so on =E2=80=94=
 even when the incompatible change affects only one of them.

        For example, if an extension modifies only the response format in=
 a backward-incompatible way, requiring a new extension identifier also f=
orces a change in the request side (e.g., query parameters or media type =
usage), even though no change is technically needed there. In practice, t=
his maximizes the impact of the change rather than minimizing it.

        From a protocol design perspective, this seems at odds with the g=
eneral goal of enabling evolution while preserving interoperability. HTTP=
-based designs typically favor extensibility and mechanisms that avoid un=
necessary breakage or =E2=80=9Call-or-nothing=E2=80=9D transitions (see R=
FC 9205).

        It may be more appropriate to:

         1. treat the extension identifier as the identity and namespace =
of the extension, and
         2. use a separate, finer-grained mechanism (e.g. version signali=
ng) to also handle backward-incompatible changes.=20

        In that model, changing the extension identifier would be reserve=
d for cases where the conceptual identity of the extension changes, rathe=
r than being the default response to any incompatible modification.

        I believe this separation would better support incremental evolut=
ion and reduce unnecessary operational and implementation impact.

        =C2=A0

        Best,

        Mario


            -andy

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        --=20

        Dott. Mario Loffredo

        Senior Technologist

        Technological Unit =E2=80=9CDigital Innovation=E2=80=9D

        Institute of Informatics and Telematics (IIT)

        National Research Council (CNR)

        Address: Via G. Moruzzi 1, I-56124 PISA, Italy

        Phone: +39.0503153497

        Web: http://www.iit.cnr.=
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ipewe976AG5LgpCNxOsehafEhmHKWlHuEHwlwKpK9rwsMcqs_iQJnhmM6ymBYnRt9sjAn4SJ3=
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--=20
Dott. Mario Loffredo
Senior Technologist
Technological Unit =E2=80=9CDigital Innovation=E2=80=9D
Institute of Informatics and Telematics (IIT)
National Research Council (CNR)
Address: Via G. Moruzzi 1, I-56124 PISA, Italy
Phone: +39.0503153497
Web: http://www.iit.cnr.it/m=
ario.loffredo
--------------t9K4o6JJdKs1V30IFRiz0cjX--