IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [rfc-i] The role of txt format in ietf document development

Paul Kyzivat <pkyzivat@alum.mit.edu> Thu, 29 October 2020 14:47 UTC

Return-Path: <rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org>
X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44CE83A08A6; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 07:47:32 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.697
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.697 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_INVALID=0.1, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, MAILING_LIST_MULTI=-1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.247, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=alum.mit.edu
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oMakylXOCZT8; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 07:47:30 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CB5153A07BD; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 07:47:30 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06837F4070B; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 07:47:17 -0700 (PDT)
X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E7F7F4070B for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 07:47:16 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org
Authentication-Results: rfcpa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=alum.mit.edu
Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9josXFXdGoaQ for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 07:47:14 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from NAM12-DM6-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-dm6nam12on2046.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.107.243.46]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 64F9BF406D8 for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 07:47:14 -0700 (PDT)
ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=PxoXIGvbI7te/F9QiiVCUm3GLQDkWisuB7IwS5co7jYEaaqN/Ew361m0oD8ao80FSCxdkfaKBu+m3YGTO2IyTpGjdzeCfiX9tvD7gWHAla/F9z/i5pO5SxV2eoE4kleP4WMKzleFo5vZhTblewyqcilXqhCb9zkUXQqktYvzViBN0aZZQ6HsUUSMw//S9m4O9+M/Foxcoo41phDonGMPAy7cZJ/OsxGPoHp2dT4fKy5/k2vvGYyHmY81y1M2lIKLQ23B7tIpvEeV742CCOmIz4iJFFRXPCoKCWLL1+VPUsRu5t0s01fkiunj0IaLrVUx8bLztq/A0pzJ7IcHhujUsg==
ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=UMelQBNevHIs4ROsI8onN3epasHL30MyFnl7hwE5yvg=; b=UnOI/ko0YOh7lrTgzcJA8SgYPIZojfGXn3r3iR9T5Km0ibH43lJjmCP0PRQjnSHjbUyXLw6QPjHdo0nedWwW1DPehGN1mJcASljVWRoJ046+gcjJzOli95O5LAdvjuQnviLIX1OUVEzbQ7RCCRhwqhCEzQ6knI/G+PWZqvLEvt0PrraKyIRn6R6jZAPvV7Hdruw/51Wvo+q5B/3GxJ55NC2tonsQEe0lJIPBmUlQOn16PTxpYKh45BZBedcNlCzGnqW964rXddV46UOkJbPdZ+Lia9CFmHRfgADv64JsCq12FFRtQi0LQfMd+883uehlUbrKYwGfmVHCUVLxTXt0iQ==
ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass (sender ip is 18.7.68.33) smtp.rcpttodomain=rfc-editor.org smtp.mailfrom=alum.mit.edu; dmarc=bestguesspass action=none header.from=alum.mit.edu; dkim=none (message not signed); arc=none
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=alum.mit.edu; s=selector2; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=UMelQBNevHIs4ROsI8onN3epasHL30MyFnl7hwE5yvg=; b=YC3OopZgM81WRoPrGrPC2QPpMCZrvBnxYa1spXPDTfiv1iZyPT+NpE2x+Dg0GNxTkQsybArSVwsgakl84Qxm5OwNDkUNt2i3BJA++9nO0isMgIdD2LGiugfIid9qJzxc+6xv5ccp0MyAgz0MBt41ZPEaKXTm3oLdhXD6P3woGfo=
Received: from SN2PR01CA0026.prod.exchangelabs.com (2603:10b6:804:2::36) by DM6PR12MB2809.namprd12.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:5:4a::16) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.3477.21; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 14:47:24 +0000
Received: from SN1NAM02FT046.eop-nam02.prod.protection.outlook.com (2603:10b6:804:2:cafe::58) by SN2PR01CA0026.outlook.office365.com (2603:10b6:804:2::36) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.3499.19 via Frontend Transport; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 14:47:24 +0000
X-MS-Exchange-Authentication-Results: spf=pass (sender IP is 18.7.68.33) smtp.mailfrom=alum.mit.edu; rfc-editor.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;rfc-editor.org; dmarc=bestguesspass action=none header.from=alum.mit.edu;
Received-SPF: Pass (protection.outlook.com: domain of alum.mit.edu designates 18.7.68.33 as permitted sender) receiver=protection.outlook.com; client-ip=18.7.68.33; helo=outgoing-alum.mit.edu;
Received: from outgoing-alum.mit.edu (18.7.68.33) by SN1NAM02FT046.mail.protection.outlook.com (10.152.72.191) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.3520.15 via Frontend Transport; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 14:47:23 +0000
Received: from PaulKyzivatsMBP.localdomain (c-24-62-227-142.hsd1.ma.comcast.net [24.62.227.142]) (authenticated bits=0) (User authenticated as pkyzivat@ALUM.MIT.EDU) by outgoing-alum.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 09TElLqK005076 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NOT) for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Thu, 29 Oct 2020 10:47:22 -0400
To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
References: <20201026215117.GY39170@kduck.mit.edu> <20201026222427.8D3B624F19C4@ary.qy> <20201026235341.GA39170@kduck.mit.edu> <47e062c3-0f1f-02fd-d77f-645863af93aa@gmail.com> <f647c3b1-37aa-f43b-6b57-cd7d895f3c23@alum.mit.edu> <f4726c74-7857-e5cb-b441-dc8b897452bf@gmail.com> <508a1288-ee51-81e6-9d4b-6284fdcb036d@alum.mit.edu> <F6DD272E-8730-4D49-92AA-1F2B4B668FA6@tzi.org> <ce1c66c5-3b7b-436c-9440-5ba69a563b08@www.fastmail.com> <31101.1603971678@localhost>
From: Paul Kyzivat <pkyzivat@alum.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <1df26944-39ad-37d0-6d8a-c037302a25e2@alum.mit.edu>
Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2020 10:47:21 -0400
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.13; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.4.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <31101.1603971678@localhost>
Content-Language: en-US
X-EOPAttributedMessage: 0
X-MS-PublicTrafficType: Email
X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: 1f40d3b4-b8b4-4190-211d-08d87c198c13
X-MS-TrafficTypeDiagnostic: DM6PR12MB2809:
X-Microsoft-Antispam-PRVS: <DM6PR12MB2809A5ED910FA827B8E33F06F9140@DM6PR12MB2809.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
X-MS-Oob-TLC-OOBClassifiers: OLM:6430;
X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck: 1
X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0;
X-Microsoft-Antispam-Message-Info: MHkDPTxKM5Wb66VeMfFNOqFdLT4miLTyuzvPC/Mea/c9RsCNBtS1vc4tcJ7ANlh5rQwSkKQasyDRG/N6roHC10LC9XzKcslfpG9goig41ibL09wWbbBz8p33SU9V7tmdQI9h8w3PIcHwNfbQJuSxF0APg67F85J+QwDLK8Mc/ISycgSNdMzHqq/OcSnOByG28pTHQ6BdxSl9PBtl49eX4p4uiMlperEbPMq9X5GJ3UypTsnPhsmZxFy0O400KKY9pFCLsbdQvPYWleTCu5WZ8XzgKgTBmuc1EajAQwm5rxeQdSyh3369TnWCGKA9tujucRS2u6Kb2JpVV6vmhY5rx9B37+CZS8rVWnGsr1B/2xVJ518BgIcTulcUA1RB6j6RRSJ5FrJ1rUuWQjfZOb3PihUT4rrg49IRgNqgpFHurnwmL033Ao7UxHrWOr1s/Ch0
X-Forefront-Antispam-Report: CIP:18.7.68.33; CTRY:US; LANG:en; SCL:1; SRV:; IPV:CAL; SFV:NSPM; H:outgoing-alum.mit.edu; PTR:outgoing-alum.mit.edu; CAT:NONE; SFS:(396003)(39860400002)(136003)(376002)(346002)(46966005)(36906005)(316002)(8936002)(336012)(31696002)(53546011)(26005)(478600001)(86362001)(75432002)(70586007)(31686004)(956004)(70206006)(82310400003)(47076004)(4744005)(186003)(82740400003)(2906002)(786003)(2616005)(356005)(8676002)(6916009)(7596003)(5660300002)(43740500002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1101;
X-OriginatorOrg: alum.mit.edu
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Oct 2020 14:47:23.6007 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 1f40d3b4-b8b4-4190-211d-08d87c198c13
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Id: 3326b102-c043-408b-a990-b89e477d582f
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalAttributedTenantConnectingIp: TenantId=3326b102-c043-408b-a990-b89e477d582f; Ip=[18.7.68.33]; Helo=[outgoing-alum.mit.edu]
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: SN1NAM02FT046.eop-nam02.prod.protection.outlook.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Anonymous
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: HybridOnPrem
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DM6PR12MB2809
Subject: Re: [rfc-i] The role of txt format in ietf document development
X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." <rfc-interest.rfc-editor.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/options/rfc-interest>, <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.rfc-editor.org/pipermail/rfc-interest/>
List-Post: <mailto:rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest>, <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=subscribe>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed"
Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org
Sender: rfc-interest <rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org>

On 10/29/20 7:41 AM, Michael Richardson wrote:

> Receiving comments in the form of a marked up word (or PDF) is, very
> bittersweet as an author.  Yes, so nice to get smart, extensive, review, but
> basically triples the effort to apply the changes.

More than triples. The problem is that, at least in ietf process, the 
comments in each such review themselves should be discussed by the group 
before being accepted or rejected.

In theory this should be handled by adding additional comments to the 
marked up document. But AFAIK there aren't good ways to thread those 
comments. (You can try to follow the timestamps, but it is difficult 
especially when comments are scattered across the document.

	Thanks,
	Paul
_______________________________________________
rfc-interest mailing list
rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email