Re: [Rfc-markdown] [xml2rfc-dev] [xml2rfc] <br> is back, was: New xml2rfc release: v2.32.0

Sandy Ginoza <sginoza@amsl.com> Fri, 18 October 2019 17:33 UTC

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From: Sandy Ginoza <sginoza@amsl.com>
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Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2019 10:33:33 -0700
Cc: Henrik Levkowetz <henrik@levkowetz.com>, Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>, "rfc-markdown@ietf.org" <rfc-markdown@ietf.org>, "xml2rfc@ietf.org" <xml2rfc@ietf.org>, "xml2rfc-dev@ietf.org" <xml2rfc-dev@ietf.org>
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References: <E1iGMu9-00055y-Ui@durif.tools.ietf.org> <8304e61d-c550-91ea-9e23-eef2cd31240b@gmx.de> <A3513970-EEB0-4DBD-9E6F-A87EBFAF886D@att.com> <de4feaff-8f71-cd38-545c-2d848749251b@levkowetz.com> <f00a671a-6fe4-f5ae-2582-0b78ffa1c256@gmx.de> <1f18382c-d830-b887-f5d3-3f376ae4fdd7@gmx.de> <B15F7AF0-F5A0-401A-9F6E-F7E0E466B6A7@amsl.com> <f4f1b7ba-127a-fbfa-531b-eeff03814281@gmx.de> <71bc8d39-d06c-d900-cc8e-04a48218d75f@gmail.com> <0905DADC-E9D5-47A7-B610-F8A62686D2BD@att.com> <07DBAE10-D1FA-45C4-B7A2-321B265CA302@amsl.com> <694c9244-98ae-1e64-39ef-8756d48b36ef@gmx.de> <860c663b-744f-a033-cc50-96088bb1b33c@gmx.de> <04DCBCE3-2C8C-4B03-9081-EF2B7A5C6087@tzi.org> <b096e29c-02a0-e009-621e-c1eca4712226@levkowetz.com> <4321EEBF-92C2-4405-81BD-899C0FCAC762@tzi.org> <5593c2d9-0bb4-93e9-f5d0-babf194340bf@levkowetz.com> <6BF7D165-EA48-44C1-9153-3F011058561F@tzi.org> <7088451e-745b-a31b-88fb-bce9cb48696a@levkowetz.com> <efb58534-8112-2303-1967-536daae9ff51@gmx.de>
To: Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de>
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Subject: Re: [Rfc-markdown] [xml2rfc-dev] [xml2rfc] <br> is back, was: New xml2rfc release: v2.32.0
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Hi all,


> On Oct 18, 2019, at 9:41 AM, Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de>; wrote:
> 
> On 18.10.2019 18:05, Henrik Levkowetz wrote:
>> 
>> On 2019-10-18 17:49, Carsten Bormann wrote:
>>> On Oct 18, 2019, at 16:54, Henrik Levkowetz <henrik@levkowetz.com>; wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I'd be more than happy to move to <br/> if we could make that useful for
>>>> the RPC.
>>>> 
>>>> I think most people who voiced an viewpoint on that was for making it
>>>> generally available, but when I proposed how to do that, it seemed to
>>>> run into opposition again.
>>> 
>>> There were some questions about line-breaking in titles in general
>>> (whether <br/> or U+2028).
>>> 
>>> I think that there is wide consensus about using <br/> in favor of
>>> U+2028.
>>> 
>>> The fact that unlike the former, the latter is not visible in the
>>> schemas makes U+2028 a great way to cheat around the consensus. We
>>> should not do that.
>>> 
>>> As in the question about restricting Unicode character sets, I
>>> believe that — as long as the vocabulary has a meaning — the schema
>>> (mechanism) is not the place to make restrictions based on beauty,
>>> style etc. (policy). So I would prefer to have <br/> in the places in
>>> the schema where it has well-defined semantics. We can figure out
>>> later whether this is always, only exceptionally, or never good
>>> style.
>> 
>> I agree with this.  So again, I propose to permit <br> as a child element
>> of these elements, where I think the semantics of a <br> would be well-
>> defined:
>> 
>>    blockquote
>>    dd
>>    dt
>>    em
>>    li
>>    name
>>    strong
>>    t
>>    td
>>    th
>>    title
>>    tt
>> 
>> Should <sub> and <sup> be in that list?  If we compare with the places where
>> for instance <bcp14> is permitted, the answer would be 'yes'; but I'm not
>> sure it's the right thing to do.
>> ...
> 
> For <title>, I will continue to ask about the use case (line break
> opportunity vs required line break vs title & subtitle), as this affects
> what would happen if it occurs in a <reference>, or if there's an <xref>
> with format="title”.

I don’t think we'll need <br> in titles; it's sufficient to have wj, nbsp, and nbhy.  

If we come across examples where <br> would be useful in titles, we can revisit this discussion at that time. However, please note that if this case arises, it means publication of the document will be delayed until xml2rfc is updated.

Thanks,
Sandy  




> 
> Best regards, Julian
> 
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