Re: [Rfced-future] Model proposal

["Joel M. Halpern" <[e-mail]>]

Thank you for clarifying Eric.  Maybe our differences are more in the 
words we use to describe things, rather than the substance.

Yours,
Joel

On 7/7/2020 10:27 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote:
> 
> 
> On Tue, Jul 7, 2020 at 5:06 PM Joel M. Halpern <[e-mail] 
> <mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
> 
>     I guess I have two differences with your description.
> 
> 
> We may be able to chalk this up to bad writing on my part.
> 
>     One aspect is that we actually hire the lawyer(s) on a long term basis.
>     We do not hire them "when we need advice".
> 
> 
> Agreed. I think that if we have an expert that requires regular deep 
> engagement with us, we should retain them on a long term basis.
> 
> 
>     The other is that in the area of direction for the RFC Series, I think
>     that we need the expertise in helping us ask the right questions on an
>     ongoing basis, not just answering questions when needed.
> 
> 
> I think I agree with this as well. When I was a consultant and when I've 
> hired consultants, often what we've wanted is precisely this kind of 
> outside strategy perspective.
> 
> -Ekr
> 
> 
>     Yours,
>     Joel
> 
>     On 7/7/2020 7:37 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote:
>      >
>      >
>      > On Tue, Jul 7, 2020 at 4:14 PM Joel M. Halpern
>     <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
>      > <mailto:[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>> wrote:
>      >
>      >     We keep a lawyer on retainer.
>      >     So the difference becomes that we are looking for someone who
>     will be
>      >     - more engaged in understanding and helping direct the
>     community (the
>      >     lawyers explicit do not direct)
>      >     - have more ongoing activities, although quite possibly less than
>      >     heretofore
>      >
>      >
>      >
>      > Well, I'm not sure about the "we" here, as I'm arguing that we
>     should
>      > not in fact be looking for this.
>      >
>      > Rather, I am arguing that the community should drive strategy
>      > (potentially with some structure like Martin proposed) and that
>     to the
>      > extent to which we need someone with specific expertise in the areas
>      > Brian has flagged, we should hire someone to advise us, in much
>     the same
>      > way we do for legal advice.
>      >
>      > -Ekr
>      >
>      >     Sounds like you are actually arguing for a senior, respected,
>      >     contractor.  With a long term relationship.
>      >
>      >     Yours,
>      >     Joel
>      >
>      >     On 7/7/2020 6:18 PM, Eric Rescorla wrote:
>      >      >
>      >      >
>      >      > On Tue, Jul 7, 2020 at 3:11 PM Brian E Carpenter
>      >      > <[e-mail]
>     <mailto:[e-mail]>
>     <mailto:[e-mail]
>     <mailto:[e-mail]>>
>      >     <mailto:[e-mail]
>     <mailto:[e-mail]>
>      >     <mailto:[e-mail]
>     <mailto:[e-mail]>>>> wrote:
>      >      >
>      >      >      > Sorry, I should have been more clear. I think this
>     is a proper
>      >      >     subject for IESG and IAB consideration, made somewhat more
>      >     difficult
>      >      >     by anchoring on a historical five author limit that
>     had (at
>      >     least to
>      >      >     me) a fairly unclear rationale.
>      >      >
>      >      >     Absolutely I think that community discussion and rough
>      >     consensus is
>      >      >     appropriate for this and other strategy or policy
>     issues. My
>      >     concern
>      >      >     is that this needs to be facilitated and informed by
>     someone with
>      >      >     relevant knowledge and experience in the
>      >      >     editing/publishing/library/archival world and that is
>     not us.
>      >      >
>      >      >
>      >      > Stipulating for the moment that this is true, I don't
>     really see
>      >     how you
>      >      > get from there to "and this person needs to be in charge
>     of the
>      >      > process". To give an example that I think I also gave on
>     the most
>      >     recent
>      >      > virtual call, we often have to do things that require a
>     bunch of
>      >      > relevant expertise in the legal world, and that's not us, but
>      >     address
>      >      > that problem by engaging a lawyer and asking their
>     opinion. Why
>      >     doesn't
>      >      > that work here?
>      >      >
>      >      > -Ekr
>      >      >
>      >      >
>      >      >
>      >      >
>      >      >
>      >      >
>      >      >
>      >
>