IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [Rift] Ipv4 and ipv6 cooperating in rift

Antoni Przygienda <prz@juniper.net> Thu, 11 July 2019 15:49 UTC

Return-Path: <prz@juniper.net>
X-Original-To: rift@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rift@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5681B120371 for <rift@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 08:49:33 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.699
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=juniper.net
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EQcCljaMMAMX for <rift@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 08:49:30 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mx0a-00273201.pphosted.com (mx0a-00273201.pphosted.com [208.84.65.16]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 22DA612038C for <rift@ietf.org>; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 08:49:13 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from pps.filterd (m0108158.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by mx0a-00273201.pphosted.com (8.16.0.27/8.16.0.27) with SMTP id x6BFhuBs000327; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 08:49:11 -0700
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=juniper.net; h=from : to : cc : subject : date : message-id : references : in-reply-to : content-type : mime-version; s=PPS1017; bh=ea1dVY2nES7kImfrXtubuLn0ApBFgV8cUFM4672wO4Y=; b=ndl+Hena69Dg36Ka0/qa5V0bhXLFDk09CMSo1E+91l91RkvHRIs34PVaKOc+GVBR1RYu B41x9qY3qAJXJ4FANInntvz4Am925bsg0YsW9qpCV5gz6t4wkYjTEkV/QhsCyveUEGH/ yT9+uQCJ6OIvBGN0yxFZjgGrPV1W1bBCL/tmFE/kG2dfQcVkISuk+lmGxC6KHhg1kaQW vR4Zd7L1CuKf05Tiu5tBljraSu0y9N9nvkWMJB4S6rggHSNDz0yha0xU8PpAd67lQ6Gy 2lcUU7nPjAT1zaECW3km/mjdRBBVfg/lAunlB4oTuhDUddkeiZroLTIbyLApVN+UETLV Ow==
Received: from nam03-co1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-co1nam03lp2052.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.40.52]) by mx0a-00273201.pphosted.com with ESMTP id 2tp7b7gbna-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 11 Jul 2019 08:49:07 -0700
ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=cZJ9fpBsYMofeIjD5FCwS4qey4Euc6upDSMVEzL5/Wib4NeQXST1BBA2iN+CLOUvAnOic2YlXxMZNOdaohTnIKi6GiQkTXAsOtcDbaZ8/8kbFWtYFOH+YfC7baiIa6JELrUYjuIg9zR6vyMxLEBZuOKCplgnyy7ibJGwSP9x2gV9HdqTswE9eVr9r8qPThhnBhrTnTbutbXlwVlzwWhoG+/Hzy7EJxlEx87QqhRPgqeRWhCvVjEN5kNI6Woui7YWIYO6dUe9Gjpdn5RrxVbhawHbtEZlCc9PFvr4R+oiuwsmxXlU7hDSA0iwOUL05hxNyjE/LG/v6udrNTgHEqEaVA==
ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=ea1dVY2nES7kImfrXtubuLn0ApBFgV8cUFM4672wO4Y=; b=NR0YOXAJ6tJMeAnGG0qK5tV02z5DJw91IGeU+5VBuHI9G7L0HAoOVOX6YrE2foXofasA2s3u+TayGQld1RacH/Ta4y5ztuN5ZuoKCDklMhJQWZIYLqPlLDmm31mympRaoJDZbNMOOxvY0ehM0MBwM9G8DlaMSYfRL0yRnmrWU3IsGtIWjoCnfgFnHv+afAcQPlCcs99Vg4JAB+WVy/4tVZ7PH+lq4yzyqIWLLLtVllcT9wMoQ4r7FSQllAj6EkdcLVJfmPFFjmCxHSpxxSKEFXGifsxuJrPbzKzlBDCl+pds+9shB2V5gKHrMsmcQb4hMA5kQzOBPwnX9JMv3Bk5uw==
ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1;spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=juniper.net;dmarc=pass action=none header.from=juniper.net;dkim=pass header.d=juniper.net;arc=none
Received: from MWHPR05MB3279.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.173.229.20) by MWHPR05MB3613.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.174.251.11) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.2073.10; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 15:49:01 +0000
Received: from MWHPR05MB3279.namprd05.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::37:4711:1630:3ff0]) by MWHPR05MB3279.namprd05.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::37:4711:1630:3ff0%10]) with mapi id 15.20.2073.008; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 15:49:01 +0000
From: Antoni Przygienda <prz@juniper.net>
To: Alvaro Retana <aretana.ietf@gmail.com>, "xu.benchong@zte.com.cn" <xu.benchong@zte.com.cn>
CC: "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>, "EXT-zhang.zheng@zte.com.cn" <zhang.zheng@zte.com.cn>, "Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang" <zzhang@juniper.net>
Thread-Topic: [Rift] Ipv4 and ipv6 cooperating in rift
Thread-Index: AQHVN/t2moUIktH57U6a1GLdGPIhbKbFjHe0
Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2019 15:49:00 +0000
Message-ID: <MWHPR05MB3279BAF107468754E6FD72EBACF30@MWHPR05MB3279.namprd05.prod.outlook.com>
References: <201907101656125835263@zte.com.cn> <MWHPR05MB3279B78E6D9AECB771D2497FACF00@MWHPR05MB3279.namprd05.prod.outlook.com>, <CAMMESsyLRtyTaMTFqzuizuNgxfRm6iuFqfun-711ayq5H4Cb8A@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAMMESsyLRtyTaMTFqzuizuNgxfRm6iuFqfun-711ayq5H4Cb8A@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-originating-ip: [108.228.12.76]
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 682d8fdb-a512-4106-69a5-08d706174b3a
x-ms-office365-filtering-ht: Tenant
x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(8989299)(4534185)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(8990200)(5600148)(711020)(4605104)(1401327)(4618075)(2017052603328)(7193020); SRVR:MWHPR05MB3613;
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MWHPR05MB3613:
x-ld-processed: bea78b3c-4cdb-4130-854a-1d193232e5f4,ExtAddr
x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: <MWHPR05MB3613D3F5F6D47944336DEF07ACF30@MWHPR05MB3613.namprd05.prod.outlook.com>
x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:10000;
x-forefront-prvs: 0095BCF226
x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(4636009)(396003)(376002)(366004)(346002)(136003)(39860400002)(189003)(199004)(6436002)(66476007)(256004)(2906002)(236005)(68736007)(64756008)(66556008)(66946007)(446003)(54896002)(33656002)(7736002)(74316002)(476003)(71190400001)(53936002)(9686003)(4326008)(229853002)(66066001)(2501003)(66446008)(76116006)(486006)(71200400001)(6246003)(25786009)(107886003)(55016002)(11346002)(105004)(81166006)(8936002)(81156014)(316002)(186003)(76176011)(7696005)(66574012)(99286004)(54906003)(110136005)(19627405001)(478600001)(52536014)(102836004)(6506007)(14454004)(3846002)(6116002)(86362001)(5660300002)(8676002)(26005)(53546011); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:MWHPR05MB3613; H:MWHPR05MB3279.namprd05.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1;
received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: juniper.net does not designate permitted sender hosts)
x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: SD1a4gj2t7S2sXp8Eub0vJtOUUzvf5N2NDa5M0CV2sUsxCGXDNTRoMuxAyIg++HdxWTtnMmFNzq7cQKItkpHqoR5a92yLB80fLlINihCE1oKySUZOtrrvQFtu732J0OK/QepkawZhPbYMOb7beOPPDEJ3Vex17ehSOQ+neRub2LWERm2UAl2w/FI/oe7/P+TErveYV5G8W3YHQdfCEI61yhkA3uWCMkQoIGddbr4OedzGYMMhVXOkuYLhGqLFTzbgeLOI4RRKpuD8CqKwYU1dbz++5u7mXgP+8vYv9ATcONo6/dCsXdctp6M0Q7vf5YXeUp60zZGUVwduO5ncrYU8f/Nj1HqSYwKVUkXY8yH4tvwr/0evjogzA/U6dlnsmvbCYAXTSYgutL15rGLh2/Ruu5xGD5yfb+xnbRPKO8oqh0=
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_MWHPR05MB3279BAF107468754E6FD72EBACF30MWHPR05MB3279namp_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginatorOrg: juniper.net
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 682d8fdb-a512-4106-69a5-08d706174b3a
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 11 Jul 2019 15:49:00.9699 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: bea78b3c-4cdb-4130-854a-1d193232e5f4
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: prz@juniper.net
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MWHPR05MB3613
X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:, , definitions=2019-07-11_03:, , signatures=0
X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_spam_notspam policy=outbound_spam score=0 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 lowpriorityscore=0 mlxscore=0 impostorscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1810050000 definitions=main-1907110177
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rift/PvvotgM8dXTo4c14NNpyb0tSNgU>
Subject: Re: [Rift] Ipv4 and ipv6 cooperating in rift
X-BeenThere: rift@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: Discussion of Routing in Fat Trees <rift.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/rift>, <mailto:rift-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/rift/>
List-Post: <mailto:rift@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rift-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift>, <mailto:rift-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2019 15:49:34 -0000

Alvaro, protocol specification requirements and router running the protocol requirements are AFAIS not the same thing. And the distinction is meaningful here.

So, the protocol DOES support IPv6 and it DOES suppoort IPv4 so it does fulfill the charter you refer to perfectly.

not to the requirements _of devices runing RIFT_:  we cannot mandate that everyone in reality will run IPv6 forwarding on the fabric so the reality is that every silicon does IPv4 today and some does IPv6. And then IPv4 over IPv6 is reality while IPv6 over IPv4 is not (since IPv6 does ND anyway so why would you).  So it is very good for v6 here to basically make it an implicit transport for v4 (by saying running v6 does _automatically_ give you v4 forwarding) while making sure that v4 being-de-facto-what-e'one-can-do is the lowest common denominator of the router's running RIFT. RIFT being only usable if a router/switch can do IPv6 is simply not a practical proposition AFAIS.  We could arguably split it into a "RIFT router/switch requirements document" but that seems just paper bloat ...

So I think we are meeting the charter mandating protocol specification perfectly while @ the same the spec is aligning with reality of v4ov6 forwarding without v4 addresses. We could just as well remove the sentence and everything would work except we'd end up in lots of discussions/possibly non-interoperable implementations in regards to v4 forwarding when no v4 addresses are present and people considering things undeployable until all the silicon in the world does v6 and everyone runs v6 by default everywhere. Which may happen but not in a foreseable future I can discern ...

I hope I do make sense ...

--- tony


________________________________
From: Alvaro Retana <aretana.ietf@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2019 8:15 AM
To: Antoni Przygienda; xu.benchong@zte.com.cn
Cc: rift@ietf.org; EXT-zhang.zheng@zte.com.cn; Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang
Subject: Re: [Rift] Ipv4 and ipv6 cooperating in rift

On July 10, 2019 at 11:05:40 AM, Antoni Przygienda (prz=40juniper.net@dmarc.ietf.org<mailto:prz=40juniper.net@dmarc.ietf.org>) wrote:

Hi!

I might be jumping in without proper context, but this text caught my attention...

b) If you want the "laziest" possible implementation then in fact yes, you can fall back on

"

All RIFT routers MUST support IPv4 forwarding and MAY support IPv6
   forwarding.  A three way adjacency over IPv6 addresses implies
   support for IPv4 forwarding.

"

…because the WG Charter says that "The protocol must support IPv6 and should also support IPv4.”   So the text above contradicts the Charter.

Alvaro.

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email