Re: [Roll] [6tisch] Thomas' remarks on draft-robles-roll-useofrplinfo-00

"Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com> Sat, 04 July 2015 10:59 UTC

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From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
To: Routing Over Low power and Lossy networks <roll@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Roll] [6tisch] Thomas' remarks on draft-robles-roll-useofrplinfo-00
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Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2015 10:58:55 +0000
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Subject: Re: [Roll] [6tisch] Thomas' remarks on draft-robles-roll-useofrplinfo-00
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On the side Ines I m willing to contribute  with formats in the compressed form from the 6LoRH draft if it is successful at 6lo.

Would you want that in?

Pascal

Le 4 juil. 2015 à 08:44, Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com<mailto:mariainesrobles@googlemail.com>> a écrit :


Ok, Thanks for the suggestions Xavi :-). We will work on that.
Cheers

On 4 Jul 2015 06:58, "Xavier Vilajosana" <xvilajosana@eecs.berkeley.edu<mailto:xvilajosana@eecs.berkeley.edu>> wrote:
Dear Ines, Michael,

It would be also very good to have several examples (drawings) detailing how Extension headers are placed in the outer IPv6 header and how this extension headers coexist (or are concatenated) with other extension headers (non-RPL) such as IPv6 Fragment Header , IPv6 Hop-by-Hop Options Header, IPv6 Header --Inner-- (EID 7), etc.. The drawings can also show how a sequence of extension headers is followed by a transport layer protocol such as UDP and if this affects HC. The examples can be complemented with the byte streams of that headers as clarification examples or to verify compliance.

It would also be good to comment about header compression and all the possibilities we have or at least point to the RFCs that detail how extension headers are compressed and when compression cannot be applied or any other consideration.

I think this draft is very valuable for most of us. Thanks for the work!

regards,
Xavi

2015-07-03 18:55 GMT+02:00 Robert Cragie <robert.cragie@gridmerge.com<mailto:robert.cragie@gridmerge.com>>:
Hi all,

Happy to help out - I will take a closer look next week.

A couple of points on first cursory read:

1) The control plane and data plane concepts should be distinct. By all means talk about control plane (i.e. RPL messages) and how they are formatted but keep this distinct from the structure of data plane packets used where RPL is used for routing. It is the data plane where IP-in-IP, RPL HbH and source routing headers are used and where the focus of the document should really be.
2) In the data plane, there are potentially two sorts of leaf node to consider: a) RPL-aware and b) not RPL-aware. This is important as it determines whether IP-in-IP is needed between nodes in a 6LoWPAN.

Robert

On 3 July 2015 at 14:52, Thomas Watteyne <watteyne@eecs.berkeley.edu<mailto:watteyne@eecs.berkeley.edu>> wrote:
Ines, Michael,
Please find my remarks about draft-robles-roll-useofrplinfo-00 below.
Thomas

----

TW> overall comments
TW> - this is a super important informational draft, which
TW>   clears up a lot of questions
TW> - I think it would be very useful to have more example
TW>   packets. We are building such information for the upcoming 6TiSCH
TW>   plugtest, so I can help there.
TW> - After this is done I would recommend to ask explicitly for
TW>   reviewers. Robert Cragie should be
TW>   on the list of people to ask; he has provided very useful info
TW>   during our discussions.


ROLL Working Group                                           M.I. Robles
Internet-Draft                                                  Ericsson
Intended status: Informational                             M. Richardson
Expires: December 29, 2015                                           SSW
                                                           June 27, 2015


              When to use RFC 6553, 6554 and IPv6-in-IPv6
                   draft-robles-roll-useofrplinfo-00

Abstract

   This document states different cases where RFC 6553, RFC 6554 and
   IPv6-in-IPv6 encapsulation is required to set the bases to help
   defining the compression of RPL routing information in LLN
   environments.

Status of This Memo

   This Internet-Draft is submitted in full conformance with the
   provisions of BCP 78 and BCP 79.

   Internet-Drafts are working documents of the Internet Engineering
   Task Force (IETF).  Note that other groups may also distribute
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   Drafts is at http://datatracker.ietf.org/drafts/current/.

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   and may be updated, replaced, or obsoleted by other documents at any
   time.  It is inappropriate to use Internet-Drafts as reference
   material or to cite them other than as "work in progress."

   This Internet-Draft will expire on December 29, 2015.

Copyright Notice

   Copyright (c) 2015 IETF Trust and the persons identified as the
   document authors.  All rights reserved.

   This document is subject to BCP 78 and the IETF Trust's Legal
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   described in the Simplified BSD License.



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Table of Contents

   1.  Introduction  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   2
   2.  Terminology and Requirements Language . . . . . . . . . . . .   2
   3.  Sample/reference topology . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   3
   4.  Example flow from leaf to root  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   4
     4.1.  Non-storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   5
     4.2.  Storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   5
   5.  Example flow from leaf to Internet  . . . . . . . . . . . . .   6
     5.1.  Non-storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   6
     5.2.  Storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
   6.  Example flow from leaf to leaf  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
     6.1.  Traditional storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
     6.2.  Traditional non-storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
     6.3.  P2P non-storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
   7.  Example flow from Internet to leaf  . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
     7.1.  Storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
     7.2.  Non-storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
   8.  Example flow from root to leaf  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
     8.1.  Storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
     8.2.  Non-storing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
   9.  IANA Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   8
   10. Security Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   8
   11. Acknowledgements  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   8
   12. References  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   8
     12.1.  Normative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   8
     12.2.  Informative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   8
   Authors' Addresses  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   8


1.  Introduction

   RPL [RFC6550] defines RPL Option to transmit routing information.
   RFC 6553 [RFC6553] defines how to transmit in a Hop-By-Hop Option RPL
   Information,such as information to avoid and detect loops.  RFC 6554
   [RFC6554] defines the use of Extension header for Source Routing.
TW> this is a bit confusing to me. AFAICT:
TW> - RFC6550 defines the RPL routing protocol
TW> - RFC6553 defines the "RPL option", carried within the IPv6 Hop-by-Hop
TW>   header to  quickly identify inconsistencies in the routing topology
TW> - RFC6554 defines the "RPL Source Route Header", an IPv6 Extension
      Header to deliver datagrams within a RPL routing domain

   Several discussions in
TW> the
   ROLL/6lo/6tisch
TW> 6tisch -> 6TiSCH
   Mailing Lists took place
   focusing in the definition
TW> of
   how to compress RPL Information in
   constrained environment.  ROLL Virtual Interim Meeting (02-2015)
   concluded that there is a need to define how to use RFC 6553, RFC6554
TW> you have to decide whether you use "RFC 123" or "RFC123". I would
TW> recommend you replace this by a hyperlink
   and tunneling (IP-in-IP)
TW> I would say "and IP-in-IP encapsulation"
   to be able to set the correct environment
   for compression.

2.  Terminology and Requirements Language

TW> you're actually not using any of this language in the draft.
TW> if you keep it that way, and since the draft is informational
TW> I would recommend to remove this section




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   The key words "MUST", "MUST NOT", "REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT",
   "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT", "RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and "OPTIONAL" in this
   document are to be interpreted as described in RFC 2119 [RFC2119].

   Terminology defined in [RFC7102]

3.  Sample/reference topology

   In a typical topology we found
TW> "we found" reads strange. What about "A RPL network is composed of
TW> ...[6LR,6LBR]... logically organized in a DODAG structure".
   6LBR (6LoWPAN Border Router), 6lR
TW> 6LR
   (6LoWPAN Router) and 6LN (6LoWPAN Node) as leaf connected in a DODAG
   (Destination Oriented Directed Acyclic Graph).  Between these
   entities messages such as DIS, DIO and DAO are transmitted.  RPL
   defines the RPL Control message as an ICMPv6 information message with
   a Type of 155.
TW> RPL defines the RPL Control message, a new ICMPv6 message with
TW> Type 155. DIS, DIO and DAO messages are all RPL Control messages
TW> but with different Code values.
   RPL supports two modes of Downward traffic: Storing,
   it is fully stateful or Non-Storing it is fully source routed.  Any
   given RPL Instance is either storing or non-storing.
TW> please specify that a RPL Instance is either fully storing or fully
TW> non-storing, i.e. a RPL Instance with a combination of storing and
TW> non-storing nodes is not supported

                             +--------------+
                             | Upper Layers |
                             |              |
                             +--------------+
                             |   RPL        |
                             |              |
                             +--------------+
                             |   ICMPv6     |
                             |              |
                             +--------------+
                             |   IPv6       |
                             |              |
                             +--------------+
                             |   6LoWPAN    |
                             |              |
                             +--------------+
                             |   PHY-MAC    |
                             |              |
                             +--------------+



                            Figure 1: RPL Stack











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                                          +---------+
                                      +---+Internet |
                                      |   +---------+
                                      |
                                 +----+--+
                                 |DODAG  |
                       +---------+Root   +----------+
                       |         |6LBR   |          |
                       |         +----+--+          |
                       |              |             |
                       |              |             |
                       |              |             |
                 +-----+-+         +--+---+      +--+---+
                 |6LR    |         |      |      |      |
           +-----+       |         |      |      |      |
           |     |       |         |      |      |      +------+
           |     +-----+-+         +-+----+      +-+----+      |
           |           |             |             |           |
           |           |             |             |           |
           |           |             |             |           |
         +-+---+     +-+---+      +--+--+       +- --+     +---+-+
         |Leaf |     |     |      |     |       |    |     |     |
         |6LN  |     |     |      |     |       |    |     |     |
         +-----+     +-----+      +-----+       +----+     +-----+


                    Figure 2: A reference RPL Topology
TW> I would add a "." at end of each caption

   In different scenarios the use of RFC 6553, RFC 6554 and tunneling
   can take place:
TW> I would say that a combination of RFC6553, RFC6554 and IP-in-IP
TW> encapsulation is used for the following traffic flows:

   -Flow from leaf to root
TW> remove newlines?
   -Flow from leaf to Internet

   -Flow from leaf to leaf

   -Flow from Internet to leaf

   -Flow from leaf to root
TW> duplicate

4.  Example flow from leaf to root

   A leaf node generates DAO and DIS messages and in general does not
   accept them.
TW> what do you mean by "accept"?
   Additionally, this kind of nodes
TW> node
   accepts DIO messages,
   but in general do
TW> does
   not generate them.  (In inconsistency A leaf node
   generates DIO with infinite rank, to fix it).
TW> A -> a




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4.1.  Non-storing

   In non-storing
TW> mode
   in this case
TW> remove "in this case"
   the leaf node uses Hop-By-Hop option (RFC
   6553) to indicate the routing information to send messages to the
   DODAG root, this message is going to be analyzed in each node until
   arrive the DODAG root.

   RFC 6554 was created to strictly send information between RPL routers
   in the same RPL routing domain.  How it would be in 6554?
TW> I assume a "TODO" missing before last sentence?

   TBD: Tunneling is necessary in case that there is information to send
   outside RPL Domain and other cases?

                          +------+
                          |      |
                          | 6LBR |
                          |      |
                          +---+--+
                              |
                              |  LoWPAN_HC
                              |  Route= 6LN-6LR-6LBR
                       ^      |
                       |  +---+-+
                       |  |     |
                       |  | 6LR |
                       |  |     |
                       |  +--+--+
                       |     |   LoWPAN_HC
                       |     |   Route= 6LN-6LR-6LBR
                       |     |
                       +     |
                          +--+--+
                          | 6LN |
                          |     |
                          |     |
                          +-----+

              Figure 3: From leaf to Root - Non-Storing Mode

TW> I don't fully understand what message this figure conveys
TW> I would use A B and C to name the nodes, and write their role
TW> next to them



4.2.  Storing

   IP6 6553{X,Y] ?ipip payload.
TW> something's wrong
   In storing mode is suitable the use of
   RFC 6553 to send RPL Information through HBH field checking the
   routing table to find out where to send the message.
TW> I don't understand "checking the routing table to find out where
TW> to send the message"
   It may include
   IP-in-IP encapsulation to transmit information not related with the
   RPL domain.
TW> I would expand this info





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                      +------+
                      |      |
                      | 6LBR |
                      |      |
                      +---+--+
                          |
                          |  LoWPAN_HC
                          |  0x63|HBH Data
                   ^      |
                   |  +---+-+
                   |  |     |
                   |  | 6LR | 6LR check in routing table
                   |  |     |
                   |  +--+--+
                   |     |   LoWPAN_HC
                   |     |   0x63|HBH Data
                   |     |
                   +     |
                      +--+--+
                      | 6LN |
                      |     |
                      |     |
                      +-----+

                Figure 4: From leaf to Root - Storing Mode

5.  Example flow from leaf to Internet

5.1.  Non-storing

   In this case the IP-in-IP encapsulation should take place to send
   information not related to the RPL domain inside of the RPL domain.

   RPL information from RFC 6553 should not go out to Internet.  The
   router sould
TW> typo
   take this information out before send the packet to
   Internet.  The HBH Option is going to be analyzed in each node to the
   root.
TW> illustrate this with a fig?

   Related to RFC 6554 the Source Header route is added and removed by
   DODAG root.  However, RFC 6554 was created to strictly send
   information between RPL routers in the same RPL routing domain.  How
   it would be in 6554?
TW> this paragraph relates to down traffic, right? The name of the section
TW> is "from leaf to Internet"









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5.2.  Storing

   In storing the information of RFC 6553 should take away by DODAG root
   before go to Internet.
TW> but as well in non-storing, no?

6.  Example flow from leaf to leaf

   can leafs insert appropriate headers, without ipip?  In [RFC6550] RPL
   allows a simple one-hop P2P optimization for both storing and non-
   storing networks.  A node may send a P2P packet destined to a one-hop
   neighbor direclty
TW> typo
   to that node.  Section 9 in [RFC6550].
TW> I would say that IP-in-IP is not needed in this case

6.1.  Traditional storing
TW> why "Traditional"?
   The route go through an ancestor that knows the route to the
   destination, using HBH [RFC6553] to carry RPL Information.

6.2.  Traditional non-storing

   The route go through the DODAG root, using source routing [RFC6554].

6.3.  P2P non-storing

   (p2p storing?  TBD)

7.  Example flow from Internet to leaf

   A DODAG root do not add routing extension to incoming packets, it
   instead uses tunneling.

7.1.  Storing

   DODAG root adds the HBH header [RFC6553] and send the packet downward
   to the destination.

7.2.  Non-storing

   DODAG root is going to add the source route header [RFC6554]

8.  Example flow from root to leaf

8.1.  Storing

   DODAG root adds the HBH header [RFC6553] and send the packet downward
   to the destination.

8.2.  Non-storing




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   DODAG root is going to add the source route header [RFC6554]

9.  IANA Considerations

   There are no IANA considerations related to this document.

10.  Security Considerations

   TBD.
TW> I would replace TBD by TODO, per usual covention

11.  Acknowledgements
TW> typo

   This work is partially funded by the FP7 Marie Curie Initial Training
   Network (ITN) METRICS project (grant agreement No.  607728)

12.  References

12.1.  Normative References

   [RFC2119]  Bradner, S., "Key words for use in RFCs to Indicate
              Requirement Levels", BCP 14, RFC 2119, March 1997.

   [RFC6550]  Winter, T., Thubert, P., Brandt, A., Hui, J., Kelsey, R.,
              Levis, P., Pister, K., Struik, R., Vasseur, JP., and R.
              Alexander, "RPL: IPv6 Routing Protocol for Low-Power and
              Lossy Networks", RFC 6550, March 2012.

   [RFC6553]  Hui, J. and JP. Vasseur, "The Routing Protocol for Low-
              Power and Lossy Networks (RPL) Option for Carrying RPL
              Information in Data-Plane Datagrams", RFC 6553, March
              2012.

   [RFC6554]  Hui, J., Vasseur, JP., Culler, D., and V. Manral, "An IPv6
              Routing Header for Source Routes with the Routing Protocol
              for Low-Power and Lossy Networks (RPL)", RFC 6554, March
              2012.

12.2.  Informative References

   [RFC7102]  Vasseur, JP., "Terms Used in Routing for Low-Power and
              Lossy Networks", RFC 7102, January 2014.

Authors' Addresses








Robles & Richardson    Expires December 29, 2015                [Page 8]
Internet-Draft                 Useof6553                       June 2015


   Maria Ines Robles
   Ericsson
   Hirsalantie 11
   Jorvas  02420
   Finland

   Email: maria.ines.robles@ericsson.com<mailto:maria.ines.robles@ericsson.com>


   Michael C. Richardson
   Sandelman Software Works
   470 Dawson Avenue
   Ottawa, ON  K1Z 5V7
   CA

   Email: mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca<mailto:mcr%2Bietf@sandelman.ca>
   URI:   http://www.sandelman.ca/

































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