RE: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Chartered
"Black, David" <david.black@emc.com> Mon, 21 December 2015 15:36 UTC
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From: "Black, David" <david.black@emc.com>
To: "Manish Kumar (manishkr)" <manishkr@cisco.com>, Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com>, "routing-discussion@ietf.org" <routing-discussion@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Chartered
Thread-Topic: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Chartered
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Date: Mon, 21 Dec 2015 15:36:02 +0000
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References: <CAG4d1rdLn2s5tkH7e4ievzJMvExCqRTbeFfs5O5ReFv+PRMY0A@mail.gmail.com> <D29D2EB9.792D%manishkr@cisco.com>
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Cc: Brian Haberman <brian@innovationslab.net>, "rtg-chairs@ietf.org" <rtg-chairs@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-tsvwg-gre-in-udp-encap@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-tsvwg-gre-in-udp-encap@ietf.org>, joel jaeggli <joelja@bogus.com>, "rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org" <rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org>, "Benoit Claise (bclaise)" <bclaise@cisco.com>, "rtgwg@ietf.org" <rtgwg@ietf.org>
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> I believe that GRE should be mandatory rather than best effort as well given its wide deployment for overlays I have no opinion on that, but suggest that any OAM work on GRE should be done with GRE/UDP in mind. Moreover, the GRE/UDP draft is likely to go to WG Last Call in TSVWG in the next month or so. GRE/UDP is a simple encapsulation, as there is no (shim) header between the UDP and GRE headers, and none will be added (in contrast to the new encapsulations which have such headers): https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-tsvwg-gre-in-udp-encap/ If there are any OAM concerns or recommendations that ought to be covered in the GRE/UDP draft, now would be a good time to bring them up - please sending comments to tsvwg@ietf.org<mailto:tsvwg@ietf.org> . The current -08 version of the GRE/UDP draft is not really ready for comprehensive review - the text on separating operator network usage from general Internet usage is "digging in the right place," but I expect that another revision is needed to get it into good shape (to their credit, the authors have the new text in my [WG chair] Inbox for review prior to posting). Hence I'd suggest focusing on OAM topics until the next version (-09) of the GRE/UDP draft is posted. Thanks, --David From: routing-discussion [mailto:routing-discussion-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Manish Kumar (manishkr) Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2015 5:57 PM To: Alia Atlas; routing-discussion@ietf.org Cc: Brian Haberman; rtg-chairs@ietf.org; joel jaeggli; rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org; Benoit Claise (bclaise); rtgwg@ietf.org Subject: Re: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Chartered Hi Alia, Good to see this integrated (rather than fragmented!); there would be more commonalities than difference of requirements. I believe that GRE should be mandatory rather than best effort as well given its wide deployment for overlays (perhaps the most widely deployed general purpose encap, keeping MPLS in a different league!). Thanks, Manish From: rtgwg <rtgwg-bounces@ietf.org<mailto:rtgwg-bounces@ietf.org>> on behalf of Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com<mailto:akatlas@gmail.com>> Date: Thursday, 17 December 2015 1:03 am To: "routing-discussion@ietf.org<mailto:routing-discussion@ietf.org>" <routing-discussion@ietf.org<mailto:routing-discussion@ietf.org>> Cc: Brian Haberman <brian@innovationslab.net<mailto:brian@innovationslab.net>>, "rtg-chairs@ietf.org<mailto:rtg-chairs@ietf.org>" <rtg-chairs@ietf.org<mailto:rtg-chairs@ietf.org>>, joel jaeggli <joelja@bogus.com<mailto:joelja@bogus.com>>, "rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org<mailto:rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org>" <rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org<mailto:rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org>>, "Benoit Claise (bclaise)" <bclaise@cisco.com<mailto:bclaise@cisco.com>>, Terry Manderson <terry.manderson@icann.org<mailto:terry.manderson@icann.org>>, "rtgwg@ietf.org<mailto:rtgwg@ietf.org>" <rtgwg@ietf.org<mailto:rtgwg@ietf.org>> Subject: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Chartered Based on the presentation by Greg Mirsky and discussion in rtgwg and elsewhere, I have decided to charter a fast-moving Routing Area design team to work on Overlay OAM. The charter is below: In the Routing Area, several WGs (e.g. NVO3, BIER, and SFC) are working on relatively new encapsulations to create overlays. These overlay or service encapsulations are transport-independent since they may be over different transports or at different layers in the networking stack. Each WG is starting to discuss what OAM and tools need to be developed (see draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-00, draft-ietf-bier-oam-requirements-00, and individual drafts in NVO3). With increasing use of overlay and service layer tunnels, extensions to traceroute to allow visibility into multiple layers are being discussed (e.g. draft-nordmark-nvo3-transcending-traceroute-01). There is an opportunity to propose protocols and methods to provide Overlay OAM in a sufficiently generic fashion that they can meet the requirements and be applied to at least BIER, NSH, VXLAN-GPE, GENEVE, and GUE. A truly successful result would also be applicable to other technologies. This Design Team is chartered to first produce a brief gap analysis and requirements document to focus its work on protocol extensions. This should be published by March 2016. With that basis, this Design Team is chartered to rapidly propose extensions to existing IETF OAM protocols such as those discussed in [RFC 7276] and new ones to support the requirements for OAM from NVO3, BIER, and SFC. The Design Team will produce an initial proposal by IETF 95. It is expected that the initial proposal will provide guidance to additional people who will be interested in working on the details and gaps. The Design Team will consider the preliminary OAM requirements from NVO3, BIER, and SFC. The Design Team should align with the LIME WG's work on common YANG models of OAM. The members of the design team are: Greg Mirsky (DT lead) Ignas Bagdonas Erik Nordmark Carlos Pignataro Mach Chen Santosh Pallagatti Deepak Kumarde David Mozes Nagendra Kumar Nainar The design team has a private mailing list that will be publicly archived. The mailing list is rtg-ooam-dt@ietf.org<mailto:rtg-ooam-dt@ietf.org>. The design team will also use a wiki to track some information. Others are also welcome to comment and interact there. The wiki is at: http://wiki.tools.ietf.org/area/rtg/trac/wiki/RtgOoamDT Regards, Alia
- Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Chartered Alia Atlas
- RE: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Antoni Przygienda
- Re: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Jeff Tantsura
- Re: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… VAN DE VELDE, Gunter (Gunter)
- RE: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Qin Wu
- Re: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Loa Andersson
- Re: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Thomas Morin
- Re: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Thomas Morin
- Re: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Manish Kumar (manishkr)
- RE: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Black, David
- RE: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Gregory Mirsky
- RE: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Russ White
- RE: Design Team on Overlay OAM in Routing is Char… Russ White