Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality
Monty Montgomery <xiphmont@gmail.com> Fri, 15 November 2013 05:39 UTC
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References: <52855B35.3080605@nostrum.com> <CEAAB858.AA2AF%stewe@stewe.org> <CAGgHUiShX3wYpFCjUP9cK6isjQLMYDYcYCTbc=Ene9wHfaeNPQ@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2013 00:39:07 -0500
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From: Monty Montgomery <xiphmont@gmail.com>
To: Leon Geyser <lgeyser@gmail.com>
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Cc: "rtcweb@ietf.org" <rtcweb@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality
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Stephan just implied strongly they haven't, despite the 20 years. And, BTW, I was serious when I mentioned Theora earlier as well. Monty On Fri, Nov 15, 2013 at 12:33 AM, Leon Geyser <lgeyser@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi everyone, > Maybe MPEG-1 Part 2 would be a better alternative to H.261. How can we > figure out if all the patents have expired for MPEG-1 Part 2? > > > On 15 November 2013 03:37, Stephan Wenger <stewe@stewe.org> wrote: >> >> Folks, >> Please don’t consider H.261 and MPEG-1 part 2 as being in the same league >> in terms of coding efficiency or network friendliness. They clearly are >> not. >> H.261 is what many call the first generation video coding standard. >> MPEG-1 (and MPEG-2) are second generation. >> MPEG-1 has half-pel motion compensation. H.261 has not. >> MPEG-1 has B frames. H.261 has not. >> MPEG-1 has (arbitrary sized) slices that can be used for MTU size matching >> (although they are not commonly used for that purpose). H.261 has not. >> Instead, H.261 has the Group Of Block picture segmentation mechanism, that >> is clearly more optimized for parallel processing than for MTU size >> matching. >> MPEG-1 allows for significantly larger motion vectors (necessitated by B >> frames and the resulting longer prediction interval, but can be used even in >> P frame only coding). >> MPEG-1 has arbitrary picture sizes. H.261 allows QCIF, CIF, and 4CIF (in >> “still image” mode, designed for low frame rate application; could run at >> high frame rate though). >> H.261 was ratified (in its first version) in 1988, and in the for all >> practical purposes final version in 1989. Most people believe that all >> related patents have expired. >> MPEG-1 was ratified in late 1992. Its “bug fix” successor MPEG-2 (which >> adds interlace support) was ratified less than a year later. There are at >> least two major disputes going on today regarding technology allegedly >> infringed by a compliant implementation of MPEG-2. Based on my technical >> understanding, one of these technologies is not in any way related to >> interlaced. >> Draw your own conclusions. >> Regards, >> Stephan >> >> >> >> >> From: Adam Roach <adam@nostrum.com> >> Date: Thursday, 14 November, 2013 at 15:22 >> To: "rtcweb@ietf.org" <rtcweb@ietf.org> >> Subject: Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality >> >> On 11/14/13 17:16, Adam Roach wrote: >> >> At 74 seconds and 4.7 MBytes (i.e., 37.6 Mbits), this encoding works out >> to 508 kbits/second total. >> >> >> Whoops, I messed up my math. It's 148 seconds long, not 74 (Quicktime >> seems to divide it by two for some reason, although the javascript decode >> does the right thing). This works out to 254 kbps. >> >> /a >> >> _______________________________________________ >> rtcweb mailing list >> rtcweb@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb >> > > > _______________________________________________ > rtcweb mailing list > rtcweb@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb >
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality (was: I'd … Leon Geyser
- [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality (was: I'd love… Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality (was: I'd … Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Gili
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality (was: I'd … Justin Uberti
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Gili
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality (was: I'd … Adam Roach
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Adam Roach
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Stephan Wenger
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Leon Geyser
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Monty Montgomery
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Leon Geyser
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Magnus Westerlund
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality (was: I'd … cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality (was: I'd … Justin Uberti
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Adam Roach
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality (was: I'd … Justin Uberti
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Stephan Wenger
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Gunnar Hellstrom
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Adam Roach
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Stephan Wenger
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Toerless Eckert
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Toerless Eckert
- Re: [rtcweb] H261/MPEG-1 video quality Maik Merten
- [rtcweb] Trellis IPR status? (Re: H261/MPEG-1 vid… Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] Trellis IPR status? (Re: H261/MPEG-1… Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] Trellis IPR status? (Re: H261/MPEG-1… Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] Trellis IPR status? (Re: H261/MPEG-1… Maik Merten