Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal
Suhas Nandakumar <suhasietf@gmail.com> Mon, 10 November 2014 23:06 UTC
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Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2014 13:06:31 -1000
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From: Suhas Nandakumar <suhasietf@gmail.com>
To: Roman Shpount <roman@telurix.com>
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Subject: Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal
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+1 on this proposal . Hope IETF91 would be a decision making for this pending item Cheers Suhas On Mon, Nov 10, 2014 at 11:14 AM, Roman Shpount <roman@telurix.com> wrote: > Even though I am not 100% happy with this proposal and that it probably > needs a bit of language clean up, I do support this proposal. > > _____________ > Roman Shpount > > On Sun, Nov 9, 2014 at 9:08 PM, Adam Roach <adam@nostrum.com> wrote: > >> It appears that we're running headlong into another in-person discussion >> about the relative merits of H.264 and VP8 as MTI candidates again. Matthew >> Kaufman has argued that this conversation is doomed to failure because no >> major player has been willing to change their position. The players he >> cited were Cisco, Google, and Mozilla, who have represented the three main >> positions on this topic pretty effectively. Although we participate as >> individuals in the IETF, I think it's fair to say that the last time we had >> this conversation, the median positions of participants from those >> companies were "H.264 or die", "VP8 or die", and "either one as long as >> it's *only* one", respectively. >> >> However, even if nothing else has changed, I think one salient point may >> have become quite important: we're all tired of this. Over two years ago, >> in March of 2012 -- before I even had an particular interest in WebRTC >> except as a user -- this had already become such a long-running acrimonious >> debate that I was brought in as a neutral third party to try to mediate. >> I'm weary of this argument; and, with the exception of a few aggressive >> voices who seem to enjoy the battle more than the outcome, I'm hearing a >> similar exhausted timbre in the messages of other participants (and the key >> stakeholders in particular). >> >> So, I want to float a proposal that represents a compromise, to see if we >> can finally close this issue. First, I want to start out by reiterating a >> well-worn observation that the hallmark of a good compromise is that nobody >> leaves happy, but everyone can force themselves to accept it. And I want to >> be crystal clear: the solution I'm about to float just barely clears the >> bar of what I think I can live with. This proposal is based on an >> observation that the dominating issues in this conversation remain those of >> licensing, not technology or even incumbency. I’ve discussed this >> extensively with representatives of all three of the players I mention >> above, and they are willing to sign on. >> >> This proposal is based on the definitions of "WebRTC User Agent", "WebRTC >> device", and "WebRTC-compatible endpoint" in section 2.2 of >> draft-ietf-rtcweb-overview-12.txt. My proposal would be as follows: >> >> >> 1. WebRTC User Agents MUST implement both VP8 and H.264. >> >> 2. WebRTC devices MUST implement both VP8 and H.264. If compelling >> evidence arises that one of the codecs is available for use on a >> royalty-free basis, such as all IPR declarations known for the codec being >> of (IETF) Royalty-Free or (ISO) type 1, the IETF will change this normative >> statement to indicate that only that codec is required. For absolute, >> crystal clarity, this provision is only applicable to WebRTC devices, and >> not to WebRTC User Agents. >> >> 3. WebRTC-compatible endpoints are free to implement any video >> codecs they see fit, if any (this follows logically from the definition of >> "WebRTC-compatible endpoint," and doesn't really need to be stated, but I >> want this proposal to be as explicit as possible). >> >> >> This has the property of ensuring that all devices and user agents can >> work with all devices and user agents. This has the property of giving no >> one exactly what they want. And, unlike any other previous plans, this has >> the property of coming to a decision while maintaining pressure on the only >> parties who can make a change in the IPR landscape to do so. >> >> /a >> >> _______________________________________________ >> rtcweb mailing list >> rtcweb@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > rtcweb mailing list > rtcweb@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb > >
- [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Adam Roach
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Lorenzo Miniero
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Jonathan Rosenberg
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal DRAGE, Keith (Keith)
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Bernard Aboba
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal tim panton
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Daniel-Constantin Mierla
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Timothy B. Terriberry
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Cavigioli, Chris
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Tim Panton
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Daniel-Constantin Mierla
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Cullen Jennings
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Cavigioli, Chris
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Stephan Wenger
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Adam Roach
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Justin Uberti
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Eric Rescorla
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Mary Barnes
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Emil Ivov
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Roman Shpount
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Eric Rescorla
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal David Singer
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Suhas Nandakumar
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Bernard Aboba
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Adam Roach
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Tim Lindsey
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Roman Shpount
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal David Singer
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Justin Uberti
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Bernard Aboba
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Alexandre GOUAILLARD
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Roman Shpount
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Bernard Aboba
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Victor Pascual Avila
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Andrew Allen
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Peter Saint-Andre - &yet
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Martin Thomson
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal tim panton
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Adam Roach
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Gaelle Martin-Cocher
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal stephane.proust
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Gaelle Martin-Cocher
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Shijun Sun
- Re: [rtcweb] MTI Video Codec: a novel proposal Florian Weimer