Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated...If not now, when"
cowwoc <cowwoc@bbs.darktech.org> Wed, 13 November 2013 22:32 UTC
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Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2013 17:32:17 -0500
From: cowwoc <cowwoc@bbs.darktech.org>
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To: Kaiduan Xie <kaiduanx@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated...If not now, when"
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I agree. I'm just pointing out that John's argument (quoted below) doesn't make any sense. Choosing "no MTI" doesn't make Cisco any more likely to implement VP8. If we choose "No MTI" we will end up with transcoding, plain and simple. One crowd will only implement H.264. The other crowd will only implement VP8. All the useless middlemen will rejoice, having killed a technology that puts them out of business. Providing "video chat without a plugin" is not revolutionary. Flash is already installed on 95% of the market. That's more people than WebRTC can reach today, so we're not "liberating" those people from anything. The real revolution is P2P: massive cost savings, ease of deployment and most importantly: cutting out the middle man. The status quo (H.264 over Flash) does not do this. P2P cannot work unless 95% of clients can agree on a common codec. I say again: start with H.261 and upgrade to VP8 or H.264. This way everyone can be happy: * The VP8 crowd can use VP8 * The H264 crowd can use H264 * The enterprise crowd can transcode * If all of the above fails, we can fallback on H.261. Yes, this carries the burden of implementing H.261 but this is a solved-problem. There are plenty of free implementations and is a much easier problem to solve than getting the H.264 and VP8 crowd to agree to implement each other's codec. Start with H.261 and replace it the moment you find something better. Forcing us to transcode or drop video calls is not a solution. Gili On 13/11/2013 4:57 PM, Kaiduan Xie wrote: > "if an implementer gets sued they can simply drop the codec" > > Thing is not that simple as "simply drop the codec", for some case you > still have to pay a lot of money. > > /Kaiduan > > On 13/11/2013 11:55 AM, John Leslie wrote: > > And I claim that both camps are actually more likely to > implement > (or allow extensions for) the other side's codec if it is > _not_ MTI, > simply because they can back out at the first sign of lawyers. >
- [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated...If… Mike Linksvayer
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Basil Mohamed Gohar
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… David Singer
- [rtcweb] where that h264 plugin can be used Tim Panton
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… John Leslie
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] where that h264 plugin can be used Martin Thomson
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Adam Roach
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Kaiduan Xie
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Michael Thornburgh
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Cullen Jennings (fluffy)
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Silvia Pfeiffer
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Justin Uberti
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Philipp Hancke
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Matthew Kaufman (SKYPE)
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Matthew Kaufman (SKYPE)
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Justin Uberti
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Philipp Hancke
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Tim Panton
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Silvia Pfeiffer
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Jonathan Rosenberg
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Gili
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Göran Eriksson AP
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Leon Geyser
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Gili
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… John Leslie
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… John Leslie
- Re: [rtcweb] where that h264 plugin can be used Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Mo Zanaty (mzanaty)
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Mo Zanaty (mzanaty)
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Marco Stura
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Kaiduan Xie