Re: [rtcweb] Cisco to open source its H.264 implementation and absorb MPEG-LA licensing fees

Basil Mohamed Gohar <basilgohar@librevideo.org> Fri, 13 December 2013 03:00 UTC

Return-Path: <basilgohar@librevideo.org>
X-Original-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CE411AE5F9 for <rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:00:01 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.9
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6_4A4V0rRw3L for <rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 12 Dec 2013 18:59:59 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail.zaytoon.hidayahonline.net (zaytoon.hidayahonline.net [173.193.202.83]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 575A91AE5F8 for <rtcweb@ietf.org>; Thu, 12 Dec 2013 18:59:59 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [192.168.1.100] (d60-65-38-134.col.wideopenwest.com [65.60.134.38]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: basilgohar@librevideo.org) by mail.zaytoon.hidayahonline.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id EA23365A7B1 for <rtcweb@ietf.org>; Thu, 12 Dec 2013 21:59:52 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID: <52AA7826.9020409@librevideo.org>
Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2013 21:59:50 -0500
From: Basil Mohamed Gohar <basilgohar@librevideo.org>
Organization: Libre Video
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: rtcweb@ietf.org
References: <186CE8D65BA3A741A81A543F936DD0D10A5803D8@xmb-rcd-x07.cisco.com> <A672E2AB-827D-46E8-9EB1-D7ED82B10B94@cisco.com> <20131211193239.GK3245@audi.shelbyville.oz> <558F8D49-4024-4DF1-9A9E-AF422F1292C2@iii.ca> <20131212011550.GM3245@audi.shelbyville.oz> <E8882BCE-4795-4CF5-B785-18C2141A5DE2@iii.ca> <20131212183852.GN3245@audi.shelbyville.oz> <9B19C671-4356-4918-B271-D95B7AA84BBA@iii.ca> <20131212213234.GQ3245@audi.shelbyville.oz> <52AA37E2.1070202@gmail.com> <20131212234430.GT3245@audi.shelbyville.oz> <28230E1E-A834-4C49-AC46-DBCC9818CEF5@iii.ca> <CAP7VpsU3Kab9pFENanO_uecr6BOKxtLPc37mnTx3C-tjKpbP=g@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAP7VpsU3Kab9pFENanO_uecr6BOKxtLPc37mnTx3C-tjKpbP=g@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [rtcweb] Cisco to open source its H.264 implementation and absorb MPEG-LA licensing fees
X-BeenThere: rtcweb@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Real-Time Communication in WEB-browsers working group list <rtcweb.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/rtcweb>, <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/rtcweb/>
List-Post: <mailto:rtcweb@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb>, <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2013 03:00:01 -0000

On 12/12/2013 08:12 PM, Jack Moffitt wrote:
>> The thing that is hard is making a compile match an existing binary when you don't really know how the original binary was compiled. The plan here is to exactly describe the process that Cisco uses to compile (which linux distro, which version, which compiler version etc, all the build scripts etc). Then any external group, such as Mozilla, can replicate theses instructions and get the same binary. I do realize that if you build the same code on even very similar systems, you may get a different binary. I realize it is not trivial to get this to all happen but we are confident it can be done.
> 
> This sounds very fragile. Why not just create a public EC2 image that
> can build the code, and then everyone will have the same setup and it
> will be easy to replicate. Or even better, just a standard chef or
> puppet script that uses a well known stock public EC2 AMI.
> 
> jack.

I know it might sound like a lot of work, but this idea actually makes a
lot of sense and goes a long way toward resolving any ambiguities and
will make the reproduceability of the binaries all the more easier to
confirm.  And it will basically take away almost any claim the Cisco or
other parties are trying to be insidious with their binary offer.

The chef/puppet script idea is actully really swell because it will show
the exact system configuration used to produce the build.

This might add more work than planned for Cisco, but it definitely will
pay off in the long run.  These could even be community-developed, as
long as Cisco made it clear which ones they used.

For example, for Fedora, there's already a very healthy community for
self-building packages, so this openness would be embraced readily by
many such users in Fedora as well as the greater "Enterprise Linux"
community (e.g., RHEL, CentOS, Scientific Linux, etc.).  Most likely,
members from this community would contribute their experience in
preparing these configuration scripts and Cisco can kickstart their
building for that platform.

-- 
Libre Video
http://librevideo.org