Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F034621F8C96 for ; Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:18:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.196 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.196 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.402, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gfiTJWIei6Q8 for ; Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:18:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from blu0-omc2-s33.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc2-s33.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.111.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84FDA21F8C69 for ; Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:18:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from BLU152-W19 ([65.55.111.73]) by blu0-omc2-s33.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:18:51 -0700 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_7db1a15e-2022-4fd7-bd42-308b78186637_" X-Originating-IP: [24.17.217.162] From: Bernard Aboba To: Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 09:18:50 -0700 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: References: <9C8CA816-65FB-41A0-999C-4C43128CAAB4@danyork.org>,

, , MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Oct 2011 16:18:51.0215 (UTC) FILETIME=[F45BF5F0:01CC8F43] Cc: rtcweb@ietf.org Subject: Re: [rtcweb] A plea for simplicity, marketability - and... who are we designing RTCWEB for? X-BeenThere: rtcweb@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: Real-Time Communication in WEB-browsers working group list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 16:18:53 -0000 --_7db1a15e-2022-4fd7-bd42-308b78186637_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > 1. Alice and Bob are on the same site (e.g.=2C PokerStars) and are > calling each other via P2P media=2C > 2. Alice and Bob are on the same site and are calling each other > via media over WS. >=20 > In the first case=2C I don't see why this would allow us to relax any of > the security requirements. As long as Alice and Bob are sending media to = each other=2C we still > cannot trust the site to adequately verify consent=2C so we clearly need > ICE. As for the need for E2E security=2C this seems equally important reg= ardless of whether > Alice and Bob share the same site. [BA] I agree. Where there is P2P media=2C ICE is required. =20 > In the second case=2C I agree that you don't need to verify consent becau= se it's > implicit in the WS protocol. (I'm leaving aside the question of whether u= sing WS > this way is advisable)=2C but the need for E2E security seems equal if > not greater=2C since in this case the site would have direct access to th= e media. [BA] Yes=2C that was my point.=20 = --_7db1a15e-2022-4fd7-bd42-308b78186637_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

>=3B 1. Alice and Bob are on the same site (e.g.=2C PokerStars) = and are
>=3B calling each other via P2P media=2C
>=3B 2. Alice an= d Bob are on the same site and are calling each other
>=3B via media o= ver WS.
>=3B
>=3B In the first case=2C I don't see why this woul= d allow us to relax any of
>=3B the security requirements. As long as = Alice and Bob are sending media to each other=2C we still
>=3B cannot = trust the site to adequately verify consent=2C so we clearly need
>=3B= ICE. As for the need for E2E security=2C this seems equally important rega= rdless of whether
>=3B Alice and Bob share the same site.

[BA] = I agree. =3B Where there is P2P media=2C =3B ICE is required.
&n= bsp=3B
>=3B In the second case=2C I agree that you don't need to verif= y consent because it's
>=3B implicit in the WS protocol. (I'm leaving = aside the question of whether using WS
>=3B this way is advisable)=2C = but the need for E2E security seems equal if
>=3B not greater=2C since= in this case the site would have direct access to the media.

[BA] Y= es=2C that was my point.

= --_7db1a15e-2022-4fd7-bd42-308b78186637_--