IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [rtcweb] Requesting "SDP or not SDP" debate to be re-opened

Peter Thatcher <pthatcher@google.com> Wed, 19 June 2013 18:41 UTC

Return-Path: <pthatcher@google.com>
X-Original-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B31CB21F99F0 for <rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 19 Jun 2013 11:41:13 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.89
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.89 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.087, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, NO_RELAYS=-0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uzcA6Jz8mRKv for <rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 19 Jun 2013 11:41:13 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pb0-x22d.google.com (mail-pb0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c01::22d]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21B2A21F997F for <rtcweb@ietf.org>; Wed, 19 Jun 2013 11:41:13 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pb0-f45.google.com with SMTP id mc8so5363780pbc.32 for <rtcweb@ietf.org>; Wed, 19 Jun 2013 11:41:12 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=NgZ8CXO03GQVnxpW8VPyB1Z4RO0l+GJORndF5h3UMfQ=; b=MyKg6UARvDVnt/mtLFFIbDEudn+ApXNHMcwpMUMvseI9czx8n2Nsm0GO6MFms6KDOy 4Bmq55ZRdz3ys7pCdPT0qKs1LpqIkiEO0Z5Go915fQCfSiRzC37zV+ctknMZaLZ04J9P lRSKZVpAT7RtduoFq/Y7RKiGQ5eKCmHR0PsS2gPktJ48xy/Vhuf9HeEPcvALTcT6T9Uy xjN33nfXu40SxvxzJY9dvczLYlN0kGjr9O0HMX7cY2AJgNk4aDfsiq57kCAP583Htbnh GG6G1OnfT4DWfp8LOzmJ7cBV+Jx/XLLgSgT9+MvF53w3JUn/9/ysVR1VBbr4YzA2aiV9 htkA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:x-gm-message-state; bh=NgZ8CXO03GQVnxpW8VPyB1Z4RO0l+GJORndF5h3UMfQ=; b=R/Gw0AYBj5WGGPuD1XDDbwow+BWBEahreTrSkHmrqbjCXM0b0eGloPdqmsoMWtYm8S J37Q8C8dx4Q7BJS6wYqF3+2zMLjIplujZZP4NFkwm/5IkXv/03VqeHGEPivUMtTmERz5 vmYZRHSBawxkY6ANkkeR9/RcaJXwSdImaUhE88P7vWRJEoHfcBIjhsNTcGQpAZGNSRqm dq/nbYyG3zCvLfs8+Cpihk25bOEXUWbru/XTGsQ9qrZKC0m745FnS5dZt7aIMNxKIdOa gy3lfvPkjgZRowb4vQUPxsZujpcCrucSrh1kUh9i9ogV0WkGVFWrSs3IU4DT4B6CcQBh 6AaA==
X-Received: by 10.68.19.72 with SMTP id c8mr3985712pbe.219.1371667272782; Wed, 19 Jun 2013 11:41:12 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.66.88.8 with HTTP; Wed, 19 Jun 2013 11:40:31 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <51C1EE64.1010109@matthew.at>
References: <CALiegfkajJPxWZTzjYssP91VW+StStLpxoxGCkjOLKDMUWc0rA@mail.gmail.com> <51C0C1A0.9010107@nostrum.com> <CAJrXDUGqSvsosZJhcRR-kCwEX1g_wvPnSZPmmcNwggk+Z9WNCA@mail.gmail.com> <CABkgnnWfV=5xBaRqAddqUURThs9J4T4+0HK4Ux07VA51r5oC3Q@mail.gmail.com> <CAJrXDUFNGKvWHw-yqeApEdTeuqMNPTDxvdKZ2DuzANmcR2y2CQ@mail.gmail.com> <7594FB04B1934943A5C02806D1A2204B1C3AE500@ESESSMB209.ericsson.se> <CALiegfk39prkSinDCisSqOAD8yJZuGUwLAMBabao7eHuhnAYcA@mail.gmail.com> <CAJrXDUHe=vu2695xAkg2tKvQ7J5JNqraHCpY0rKx5rDQ0xCpiA@mail.gmail.com> <CALiegf=GbR3K0dzMkaMWu88WdNY4JWQOmDPKeNfZQNuC5d4bog@mail.gmail.com> <CAJrXDUHG7ENOu12SkRpXOik3ArEShPHAJhtOwYyR3UaSDvQFOA@mail.gmail.com> <CALiegf=SiPkCD6b1Z+hkgkbtT1bbxtytWyYRxH3CUGDvJOztRg@mail.gmail.com> <CAJrXDUF6uujp2jYCJgxp4kTctAFDWBBU-bWhJp4iMNDuc6A+3w@mail.gmail.com> <CALiegfm_CLRBTmuJhjhrxNb5XPHGmFD9Lip37xYLVOBTxM6j_A@mail.gmail.com> <CAJrXDUGqTGCR3reZ3=PkzQE7bhvjhyNGpdCiM-TCDnusNOxjjQ@mail.gmail.com> <51C1EE64.1010109@matthew.at>
From: Peter Thatcher <pthatcher@google.com>
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2013 11:40:31 -0700
Message-ID: <CAJrXDUEekTTxnOL1wYd62kPJZBXvRT3dfNdE_OMynGJDZM_BcQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Matthew Kaufman <matthew@matthew.at>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="bcaec53af13a8b6f0604df862cc7"
X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQkWe7B7i3JBB+GYJ2x+p1ovwq8ZTIqbC7G1cTpMEiiTPDKdMNuX4hr2GSXHgE+D8M24e5MlkR8n4Iac9pEzEbM9//Pm9/k1RpJP1QIl3Aspyew3PdL/K0ymV1LF7hW9Q1nd0M4wMaZBTpZYNg6jL+Mckz5YFcBXMl/H7O18pAz1cPrie+KIFvh21fPfe5a+pxWOqq12
Cc: "<rtcweb@ietf.org>" <rtcweb@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [rtcweb] Requesting "SDP or not SDP" debate to be re-opened
X-BeenThere: rtcweb@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Real-Time Communication in WEB-browsers working group list <rtcweb.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/rtcweb>, <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/rtcweb>
List-Post: <mailto:rtcweb@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb>, <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2013 18:41:13 -0000

On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 10:46 AM, Matthew Kaufman <matthew@matthew.at>wrote:

>  On 6/19/2013 10:35 AM, Peter Thatcher wrote:
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 10:27 AM, Iñaki Baz Castillo <ibc@aliax.net>wrote:
>
>> 2013/6/19 Peter Thatcher <pthatcher@google.com>:
>> > Of course.  That's why I made a proposal that attempts to lessen the
>> pain
>> > (the NoPlan JS API).  I'm trying to help you :).
>>
>>  And don't you agree that the pain is even less if we entirely remove SDP?
>>
>>
>  I don't think it's removal of SDP that you want.  I think what you want
> is a way to use the API without using SDP.  If the SDP is still there, but
> you don't have to use it, you're still happy, right?
>
>
> I want the offer/answer state machine to go away. I don't like an API that
> requires me to fight with it to get it to do what I want, no matter what
> kinds of things I put in (SDP, JSON, wahtever).
>
>
Are you demanding both adding what you want and removing what is there?
 Or,  if you could add everything you want, but leave what is currently
there (SDP O/A), would you be content?

Why should I need to have the browser make an "offer" that I can then
> manipulate to turn into an "answer" just to get it to listen to some RTP
> and render it?
>

With my recent proposal (NoPlan JS API), you don't have to, at least not
for media streams.  You just tell the browser what to send with on the send
side, and then what to receive with on the receive side.  My proposal does
not cover transports, however.  It's an incremental improvement that
relieves some of the pain, but not all.


>
>
> Matthew Kaufman
>
> _______________________________________________
> rtcweb mailing list
> rtcweb@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb
>
>

v2.29.0 | Report a Bug | By Email | System Status