Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated...If not now, when"
Ron <ron@debian.org> Fri, 15 November 2013 12:13 UTC
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Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2013 22:42:49 +1030
From: Ron <ron@debian.org>
To: rtcweb@ietf.org
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References: <20131114225633.GR3245@audi.shelbyville.oz> <CEAAE2D9.1D7EE%mzanaty@cisco.com>
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Subject: Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated...If not now, when"
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On Fri, Nov 15, 2013 at 04:46:39AM +0000, Mo Zanaty (mzanaty) wrote: > On 11/14/13, 5:56 PM, Ron <ron@debian.org> wrote: > > > Except the proposed Cisco binary deal isn't licencing the Nokia patents, > or the Motorola patents, or any others, so they'd all still be free to > sue anyone using that. > > No licensor / licensee in the MPEG LA pool can sue anyone over H.264. > Google is a licensee, so Motorola can no longer sue anyone over H.264. > Nokia (like the old Motorola) is neither a licensor nor licensee, so it > can sue. Ah, thanks for the clarification on that. > > How is this known and proven liability somehow less of a problem than > > the absence of any such thing overshadowing VP8? > > Half a cent is less of a problem than a permanent injunction. It's only half a cent after you've shelled out the 6+ figures for the high powered lawyers though - and even then only if you 'win'. And it still means that anyone wanting to take advantage of the Cisco offer _is_ going to need to negotiate a separate licence from them. So I still don't see how this changes the original problem (even if we ignore the other remaining problems). Half a cent for each of millions of unpaying users is still effectively a permanent injunction (or worse) for many of the projects that would otherwise deploy WebRTC. I'll consider it a sad outcome if we are forced into choosing H.261 here too, but if it's the only option that "makes the patents evaporate" in a way that satisfies the objectors to VP8, then it's not worse than an outcome which limits video (and compliant WebRTC implementation) to only people that the H.264 patent holders approve of or turn a blind eye to. Ron
- [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated...If… Mike Linksvayer
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Basil Mohamed Gohar
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… David Singer
- [rtcweb] where that h264 plugin can be used Tim Panton
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… John Leslie
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] where that h264 plugin can be used Martin Thomson
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Adam Roach
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Kaiduan Xie
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Michael Thornburgh
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Cullen Jennings (fluffy)
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Silvia Pfeiffer
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Justin Uberti
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Philipp Hancke
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Matthew Kaufman (SKYPE)
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Matthew Kaufman (SKYPE)
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Justin Uberti
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Martin J. Dürst
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Philipp Hancke
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Tim Panton
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Silvia Pfeiffer
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Jonathan Rosenberg
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Gili
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Maik Merten
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Göran Eriksson AP
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Leon Geyser
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Gili
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… John Leslie
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… John Leslie
- Re: [rtcweb] where that h264 plugin can be used Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Mo Zanaty (mzanaty)
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Mo Zanaty (mzanaty)
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Marco Stura
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Ron
- Re: [rtcweb] ~"I'd love it if patents evaporated.… Kaiduan Xie