[rtcweb] UDP transport problem
Cb B <cb.list6@gmail.com> Thu, 13 February 2014 06:07 UTC
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From: Cb B <cb.list6@gmail.com>
To: "rtcweb@ietf.org" <rtcweb@ietf.org>
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Subject: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem
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Folks, For about a year now, i have been very concerned about IPv4 UDP. It has been increasingly associated with DDoS traffic [1], to the point that the protocol's reputation is akin to IPv4 PING in 2003 (widely blocked). The material point here is that IPv4 UDP is being indiscriminately blocked and policed in access networks. This is not something access networks are wantonly electing to do. This decision is made in the heat of the moment to restore service to customers and networks who are overrun with attack traffic [2]. And it is not simply DNS, NTP, and chargen for simple filtering. My suggestion is that draft-ietf-rtcweb-transports be updated to include SCTP as a transport type option. I understand that SCTP is not supported on Windows (tm) and most NATs. In general, we may find that TURN / TRAM is a required local trust anchor in access networks, just as local ISP-administered SMTP servers in access networks are frequently required relay points since access networks block SMTP. [3] This UDP concern is not an issue for IPv6, since IPv6 is not, as of yet, been associated with these massive attacks. And when i say massive, i mean massive [4]. And because of the scale and risk, access networks are simply clamping IPv4 UDP throughput and moving on and not looking back. I understand predicting the demise of UDP is not a popular opinion in the IETF. But as a network operator, and stakeholder in the internet / ietf / webrtc, i am hoping to share this information so that you all can make well informed protocol decisions. [1] http://www.us-cert.gov/ncas/alerts/TA14-017A [2] http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/nanog/users/168576 [3] http://customer.comcast.com/help-and-support/internet/email-port-25-no-longer-supported/ [4] http://rt.com/news/biggest-ddos-us-cloudflare-557/
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Martin Thomson
- [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Cb B
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Cb B
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Cb B
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Michael Tuexen
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Cb B
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Ted Hardie
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Cb B
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Cb B
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Ted Hardie
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Dave Taht
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Cb B
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Cb B
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Dave Taht
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Dave Taht
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Dave Taht
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Michael Tuexen
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Cb B
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem cowwoc
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Tim Panton
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Tim Panton
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Jeremy Laurenson (jlaurens)
- Re: [rtcweb] UDP transport problem Cynthia G. Anderson