Re: [rtcweb] My Opinion: Why I think a negotiating protocol is a Good Thing

<Markus.Isomaki@nokia.com> Wed, 19 October 2011 08:07 UTC

Return-Path: <Markus.Isomaki@nokia.com>
X-Original-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B785A21F84D8 for <rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 19 Oct 2011 01:07:41 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -3.599
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Pj6gD3e7XYCt for <rtcweb@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 19 Oct 2011 01:07:40 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mgw-da01.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.128.24]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A730521F8B3E for <rtcweb@ietf.org>; Wed, 19 Oct 2011 01:07:40 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from vaebh106.NOE.Nokia.com (vaebh106.europe.nokia.com [10.160.244.32]) by mgw-da01.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.4/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id p9J8761m025813; Wed, 19 Oct 2011 11:07:36 +0300
Received: from smtp.mgd.nokia.com ([65.54.30.6]) by vaebh106.NOE.Nokia.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 19 Oct 2011 11:07:23 +0300
Received: from 008-AM1MMR1-002.mgdnok.nokia.com (65.54.30.57) by NOK-am1MHUB-02.mgdnok.nokia.com (65.54.30.6) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.2.255.0; Wed, 19 Oct 2011 10:07:22 +0200
Received: from 008-AM1MPN1-043.mgdnok.nokia.com ([169.254.3.167]) by 008-AM1MMR1-002.mgdnok.nokia.com ([65.54.30.57]) with mapi id 14.01.0339.002; Wed, 19 Oct 2011 10:01:53 +0200
From: Markus.Isomaki@nokia.com
To: HKaplan@acmepacket.com, fluffy@cisco.com
Thread-Topic: [rtcweb] My Opinion: Why I think a negotiating protocol is a Good Thing
Thread-Index: AQHMjiUvNVhwvx21ak2ubV3jL1roG5WDSS1A
Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2011 08:01:52 +0000
Message-ID: <E44893DD4E290745BB608EB23FDDB7620DE659@008-AM1MPN1-043.mgdnok.nokia.com>
References: <4E9D667A.2040703@alvestrand.no> <9B03E9E2-4376-465E-84F5-EDAC51390408@phonefromhere.com> <B5F4C6D1-3F54-4242-A89C-C2FC66AF8E7D@cisco.com> <570BDE5E-6EDC-4094-8DC0-094CEC3F12DF@acmepacket.com>
In-Reply-To: <570BDE5E-6EDC-4094-8DC0-094CEC3F12DF@acmepacket.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-originating-ip: [172.21.75.159]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Oct 2011 08:07:23.0311 (UTC) FILETIME=[21C923F0:01CC8E36]
X-Nokia-AV: Clean
Cc: rtcweb@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [rtcweb] My Opinion: Why I think a negotiating protocol is a Good Thing
X-BeenThere: rtcweb@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Real-Time Communication in WEB-browsers working group list <rtcweb.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/rtcweb>, <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/rtcweb>
List-Post: <mailto:rtcweb@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb>, <mailto:rtcweb-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2011 08:07:41 -0000

Hi,

Hadriel Kaplan wrote:
>
>How many RTP libraries do you know of that use SDP offer/answer protocol as
>their API?
>

This confuses me too in the direction where the RTC-Web work seems to be heading. There are countless SIP user agents and XMPP clients that implement SDP offer/answer or the Jingle equivalent. But I've not  heard SDP used as an *API* towards the RTP/media libraries. So, when I think about the RTP/media API that the browser should expose to the Javascript app, I'm surprised to see SDP on that level.

I see that it may be useful to have a higher level API that provides ICE and SDP offer/answer type of functions to developers who want that. But I'm not sure if that should be a real W3C standard API or could it just be Javascript libraries. 

Having said that, I'm not going to write a "signaling" or API draft. I can live with any outcome that does not limit app developers too much. So for me at this point it would be valuable input to understand what we are *loosing* if the API were based on SDP and we would have something like ROAP. I've heard it "limits innovation" but I haven't seen concrete examples of that. So if Hadriel is going to produce a draft on these issues, it would be great if it had something like that.  

Markus